Mitchell
Mitchell's coming back soon, as Randy told us last night he was back on the ice while the rest of the team practiced. Same with Roenick. Milan is coming back soon as well.
What to do with the lines when all three are back in the lineup? I for one think the prospect of Milan skating with Mitchell is more than interesting. Maybe its just me but Cheech would work out much better on the second line than skating with Mitchell in a checking role that doesn't seem to suit him, plus Clowe gets to play at his natural left wing (though it doesn't seem to bother him much on the right side). Its only been a couple games with Cheech on the second line, but it seemed to be more potent with Milan in there instead, however much it pains me to say it.
HOWEVER, I think if you put Milan with Grier and Mitchell, and Cheech with Pavs and Clowe you have a better total 2 & 3 line whereas if you were to switch Milan and Cheech you would have a slightly better 2nd line but the total goodness of the 2nd and 3rd lines together wouldn't be as.. well, good. Then again, Cheech could get hot and there wouldn't be any decision to make.
Then you reunite the line of Shelly, Goc, Roenick, which played well together last year and you got yourself a lineup. Cup please. Only thing is Plihal has been playing well with Goc, but they can be reunited on the 4th line if someone (god forbid) gets hurt.
Thoughts? I'm new here so if this subject has been beaten to death forgive me.
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Welcome to the Site!
Great First post. I like the lines you have submitted, but Cheech just doesn’t have the speed to play with Michalek and Pavelski. He’s looked better as of late, but I’d rather put Clowe on that line. Here’s how I see the lines shaking out…
Marleau-Thornton-Setoguchi
Michalek-Pavelski-Clowe
Mitchell-Goc-Cheechoo
Shelley-Roenick-Grier
Goc has played very well as of late and is maturing into a more offensively minded player. He’s a playmaker-type center, so I think that Cheech and Mitchell would benefit from his improved play.
Granted, the coaching staff knows more about this stuff than any of us, so I’ll leave it up to them. McLellan hasn’t been afraid to change lines up from game to game (even during games). I think he sees many of his players as interchangeable parts, so putting together set lines might be a moot point anyways.
Fear the Fin: Where my signature is not the same as Mr. Plank's signature.
by That'll Cheech You on
Dec 24, 2008 2:02 PM PST
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I like your lines, it’ll be extremely nice to have Mitchell back on penalty kill as well
by gore51 on
Dec 25, 2008 9:30 PM PST
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Thanks, thats why I get paid the big (fake) bucks.
I loved Mitchell on the kill, but who’s spot does he take? Pavelski and Michalek have played fantastically, as has Marleau. I guess that leaves Grier to be replaced…
Fear the Fin: Where my signature is not the same as Mr. Plank's signature.
by That'll Cheech You on
Dec 26, 2008 12:19 AM PST
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One of the
bright spots this year for the sharks in my mind has been the play of milan michalek, this is kind of a sleeper pick with all of the good that has happened, and you are right he has been great on the PK. Mitchell and Marleau on the same PK, ouch, look for some shorties.
by mattman on
Dec 26, 2008 9:58 AM PST
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First off, I love that you’re throwing out your opinions on proposed line selections the day you sign up on the site. That’s awesome :) Welcome to FTF!
I’d have to agree with That’ll Cheech You here on the lines. Cheech just can’t hang with the second line speed, but Goc has been playing very well lately so I think that line will generate scoring opportunities with Mitchell. Roenick can be substituted on the third line either on the wing or at center (with Mitchell or Goc dropping down) if Sweeney Todd wants to switch things up a bit.
All in all, great analysis. Looking forward to more ktice.
Fear The Fin: Where The Second Round Is Overrated
by Mr. Plank on
Dec 24, 2008 2:47 PM PST
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Thanks for the welcome guys
Kind of a good thing, to be debating what to do with a surplus of legit top-6 forwards. To have Gooch and Clowe both work out like they did is quite the bounty.
For what its worth here is what my lines would look like:
Marleau-Thornton-Setoguchi
Clowe-Pavelski-Cheechoo
Michalek-Mitchell-Grier
Shelley-Goc-Roenick
In which case the third line would be the fastest line.
Or maybe a line of Shelley-Roenick-Cheechoo? I could see Roenick creating chances for Cheechoo, because his game can work in an open or a grinding environment.
by ktice on
Dec 24, 2008 2:56 PM PST
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Again though,
Cheechoo’s speed is a detriment to the play of line 2. Mitchell, to me, seems more suited as a wing type player, and Goc has earned at least the 3rd line gig for now. Grier, as much as I love the guy, should be on the checking line at best. He works hard and hits hard, but has issues in the offensive zone. Like Cheechoo on the second line, Goc would be a downer on the third.
Cheechoo is a sniper type player, and needs time to set up. He doesn’t fit the mold of line two, how it is currently constructed.
We could go with this…
2: Michalek-Pavelski-Mitchell
3: Clowe-Goc-Cheechoo
However, we don’t know what Mitchell will be like when he comes back, and Clowe has played extremely well on the second line.
Fear the Fin: Where my signature is not the same as Mr. Plank's signature.
by That'll Cheech You on
Dec 24, 2008 4:12 PM PST
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I meant to say....
Like Cheechoo on the second line, Grier would be a downer on the third.
Fear the Fin: Where my signature is not the same as Mr. Plank's signature.
by That'll Cheech You on
Dec 24, 2008 4:13 PM PST
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I agree about Grier...
I really can’t see him playing with that line at all. Also, I think it would be dumb to drop milan off that second line. I just don’t know why you would even think about breaking it up after all the success it has had, especially the power play. I guess I won’t beat the dead (cheech speed) horse to death since you guys are absolutely right on about that.
by mattman on
Dec 25, 2008 12:05 AM PST
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wait....
is it even possible to beat a dead horse to death?
by sharks on
Dec 25, 2008 6:43 PM PST
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sorry was a bit tired when i wrote that
do you have any input on the meat and potatoes of the comment if you will
by mattman on
Dec 25, 2008 7:26 PM PST
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You can take a dead horse to water...
but you shouldn’t beat them to death while switching horses midstream? Something like that?
Fear the Fin: Where my signature is not the same as Mr. Plank's signature.
by That'll Cheech You on
Dec 26, 2008 12:21 AM PST
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just messin with ya, but i will say
its a very interesting discussion. I like the idea of all your speed players on one line, but I’m not so sure it’s essential because once you get the puck in the zone (shoot it on the break/dump it in/set up all your players when the D has contorl of the puck) you just need players who will body up, play well against pressure, go to the net, etc. I look at it like the baseball fan I am, speed is a luxury and sometimes you get in trouble when you try and build around it. that might not apply as much in hockey.
biggest thing here is we have the top lines set and it makes it hard to order the bottom lines perfectly. This being a very good problem to have. I dont think id immeadiately put mitchell on the second line since that line has already played with either of cheech/clowe and played well, I think either is fine with the other on the 3rd line. my personal feelings is its not that big a difference and Id leave it up to the coaches. this might be why I havent added much, plus I’m admittedly not all that hockey smart (yet) and am bad at watching the little things during games.
2 line – milan/lil-joe/(cheech/clowe)
3 line – grier/mitchell/(cheech/clowe)
Once we get mitchell into game shape we can start messing around with it more, also I expect him to start out on the 4th line
by sharks on
Dec 26, 2008 1:28 AM PST
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why mitchell on the 4th?
after last season i say mitchell and grier have to stay together. they scored almost all our shorthanded goals last year, just think what they’d do now.
by serrapadre716 on
Dec 26, 2008 9:01 AM PST
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just because they score shorthanded
doesn’t mean they will score together 5-5. To me Grier is a guy you put on your fourth line, a grinder that just doesn’t belong on the third with all the talent we have at the moment, although I do like the play of plihal-goc-grier.
by mattman on
Dec 27, 2008 3:47 PM PST
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mitchell on 4th
to get him back into the flow of things when he comes back from the injury, nothing permanent.
by sharks on
Dec 28, 2008 5:54 PM PST
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lines
keep the first line the way it is.
2. milan-little joe-choooooooooooooooooooo
3. grier-mitchell-clowe
the reason i say that is because that third line played last year in the playoffs and we all know how clowe did when that happened. or you could switch clowe and choo since clowe is doing better for now.
by serrapadre716 on
Dec 25, 2008 10:40 AM PST
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don't know why you would take clowe off a line that is dominating right now
just doesn’t make sense to me
by mattman on
Dec 25, 2008 7:27 PM PST
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i don't know
i just can’t picture cheechoo on the ice with mitchell and grier. having a scorer on our third line with 2 penalty killers doesn’t appeal to me. good thing i don’t have to make this decision.
who’s on the 4th line? i got jr – goc – shelley. but that leaves out, well, all rookies. they’ll probably be rotated in and out.
by serrapadre716 on
Dec 26, 2008 9:05 AM PST
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just playing devils advocate
the 2nd line did play pretty well with cheech on the line early in the yr
by sharks on
Dec 28, 2008 5:57 PM PST
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quick question
If one of the rookies steps up their game play by a lot, who is the odd man out?
"Gotta suck for the other teams. You finally catch the Sharks on an off night and you still lose." -Shark Man
by idunno723 on
Dec 26, 2008 12:35 AM PST
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i say goc get's left out
we need shelley, so that leaves jr and goc. and honestly, who would you rather have? to me it’s obvious that you take jr.
by serrapadre716 on
Dec 26, 2008 9:06 AM PST
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you may not see it in the box score every night
but the play of goc this year has been tremendous and it would amaze me if he doesn’t have himself a spot on this time in the crunch time.
by mattman on
Dec 27, 2008 3:48 PM PST
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you could say the same thing about
shelley, jr, grier, mitchell, murray and all our rookies. obviously they all have something they bring that doesn’t show up in the box score.
by serrapadre716 on
Dec 28, 2008 12:15 PM PST
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speaking of box scores...
goc has been tremendous on faceoffs this year.
by mattman on
Dec 28, 2008 4:44 PM PST
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For starters, I have been pondering this very subject for a couple weeks now and I still do not have a clear cut answer.
Secondly, I completely disagree with the folks who think that Cheech doesn’t belong with Clowe and Pavs on the 2-line. They say that Cheech doesn’t have the speed to hang with the 2nd line but they need to remember that Clowe and Joe-P are not the fastest guys. They are just really hard workers. And that seems to coincide with Cheech’s game more than Michalek’s, although Milan is an incredibly hard worker too. If people do not want to break up the 2nd line because of its current chemistry, then I totally agree. But that is different then saying Cheech would not fit with Clowe and Pavs. I was at the game vs. Vancouver on Tuesday and I’ll tell you, that line looked good to me.
The prospect of Milan and Mitchell is more than interesting. A line with the two of them would have some serious get-up. I think the most important thing about putting the two of them together is that the third component to that line must be toughness, or someone to “protect” them. And Mitchell is a Center and should stay that way. Just because Marleau moved from Center to Wing doesn’t mean that a 2nd year guy can make the same transition and expect it to be seamless. And frankly, we don’t have much time to “try something new”.
Then of course, we come to the subject of Goc-Plihal. One of them will have to go, and when I was thinking of this subject earlier in the year, I would have told you that Goc goes without hesitation. But lately Goc has been playing well. He’s doing everything except scoring. Goc has been one of our better face-off guys, and losing that could really hurt the team. Plihal on the other hand has had my blessing for a year now. He works very hard and is everything I wanted Rismiller to be, and more. With Mitchell back, Plihal and Mitchell will take much of the penalty killing minutes. That will help us because Pavelski won’t have to play as much on the PK, so he will have more energy to spend elsewhere.
Marleau-Thornton-Setoguchi
Clowe-Pavelski-Cheechoo
Shelly-Mitchell-Michalek
Plihal-Roenick/Goc-Grier
I would give this lineup a try. Shelly has done nothing but surprise me when it comes to his skating and checking. I would try that 3rd line for a couple weeks and see how it plays out. Shelly would definitely be able to protect Mitchell/Michalek, he can skate pretty damn well for a big guy, the only concern I would have is his passing. That 4th line would be quite solid as a checking line. If Shelly didn’t work out on the 3rd line, I would try Roenick. JR could swing to the wing better than Mitchell, and would give the line some toughness. I don’t think JR could protect the other guys, but the line would have plenty of scoring punch. In that case Goc is needed to Center the 4th line, so Plihal would be the odd man out.
JR-Mitchell-Michalek
Shelly-Goc-Grier
I think I pulled my swagger muscle...
by BawLa on
Dec 27, 2008 10:06 AM PST
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Gotta be honest,
I really don’t like that lineup. Like I said earlier the play of Milan this year has been well documented and great. Taking him off that second line would be foolish with the way he has been playing.
by mattman on
Dec 27, 2008 3:17 PM PST
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same here, i don't like those lines
keep michalek on the 2nd line with pavs and clowe. then plihal-jr-goc on the 3rd and shelley-mitchell-grier on the 4th. oh @#$%!!! i left out cheechoo, God please help the coaching staff.
by serrapadre716 on
Dec 28, 2008 12:19 PM PST
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I think my lines above...
solve the problems here.
Fear the Fin: Where my signature is not the same as Mr. Plank's signature.
by That'll Cheech You on
Dec 28, 2008 1:04 PM PST
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think this leads
to a possible phlihal mclaren trade deadline deal
by sharks on
Dec 28, 2008 6:08 PM PST
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wouldn't be surprised if he's traded,
we’ve got some depth and the dude can still shoot the puck, somebody could use him.
by mattman on
Dec 31, 2008 10:06 PM PST
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