WTC: McGinn and Couture reassigned to Worcester... or, not.
So, we got some mixed signals this morning. After receiving a heads up from our people in Worcester, it appeared as if Logan Couture and Jamie McGinn were being sent back to Worcester.
However, Pollack just updated WTC, and noted that one or both of those players were going to be on the trip to Columbus, and none of the four players currently sidelined with injuries (Pavelski, Mitchell, Vesce and Setoguchi) are ready to return. Setoguchi isn't even skating, but is back on the stationary bike.
We'll probably see how the roster will shake out as we get closer to Wednesday's game.
4 months ago
That'll Cheech You
54 comments
0 recs |
Email
PrintComments
but it now looks as if injured Sharks aren’t ready to return after all
Hopes are down again…
by Section223 on Nov 2, 2009 10:41 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Was just writing about this when you posted it. Looks like the injured guys are a little further away than anticipated.
I’m kinda surprised McGinn was chosen to be sent down. He’s really been clicking lately, and has been a good energy/skill guy for the 3rd line with Nichol and Orts. I’d kinda like to see if he can keep growing into the player we all assume he’ll be. He looked to really be growing…and I’m not sure going back to Worcester is going to help him too much at this point in his development. But I guess the Sharks know best.
Sometimes the impossible can become possible if you're AWESOME!
by ZeroIndulgence on Nov 2, 2009 10:45 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
McGinn has been solid in his recent call up, I’d rather see Ferriero sent down (as much as I like the kid, he hasn’t done much at all lately and he’s on a better line).
by Evilducks on Nov 2, 2009 11:49 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Am I totally out of line
For wanting Staubitz sent down? I know he’s got some goals, but, maybe give Logan another winger with more scoring prowess?
They're not getting this kind of coverage at "Hockey Night In Canada" folks! - Randy Hahn
by ElvisVF101 on Nov 2, 2009 12:11 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I’m on board with that— haven’t been a big fan of Shelley and Staubitz on the same line since last offseason. The only problem is that Staubitz would have to clear waivers on the way down. At this point in the year, with all the injuries hitting the NHL, he might be claimed.
I think it’s likely they keep him around as a healthy scratch all season long.
Fear The Fin: Where Selling Your Soul Is The Likely Solution
by Mr. Plank on Nov 2, 2009 12:17 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Cap implications
What are the cap implications for another team picking up a guy like Staubitz from us? Is it a move worth risking now or later in the season?
They're not getting this kind of coverage at "Hockey Night In Canada" folks! - Randy Hahn
by ElvisVF101 on Nov 2, 2009 12:39 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I think we'd be responsible for half of his salary
"iaT"S FUCKINGE LIEK CONICO DO MAYO!!!!!111"
Mr. K. 5/5/2009
by Morti on Nov 2, 2009 12:46 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
That’s on re-entry waivers (see Avery, Sean). If he is claimed going “down”, then the Sharks don’t have any cap hit against them besides what Staubitz has already accrued during his time on the roster.
He is not subject to re-entry waivers because he has a two-way contract (i.e. he will be able to be called “up” without the threat of another team claiming him).
The CBA is insane.
Fear The Fin: Where Selling Your Soul Is The Likely Solution
by Mr. Plank on Nov 2, 2009 12:56 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
If he is claimed by another team, his cap hit comes off the books— the only portion that remains is what he has accrued up to this point. A NHL season is something like 190 days long (estimate), and his cap hit is $500,000. Therefore, for each day he is on the roster, he takes up roughly $2,631 of cap space. 33 days thus far means he has accounted for roughly $86,823 of space.*
*Note that these are estimates, but is close to the actual total.
If he is claimed by a team going down, we will not have to pay the rest of his salary, nor will we on the hook for his remaining cap hit.
Fear The Fin: Where Selling Your Soul Is The Likely Solution
by Mr. Plank on Nov 2, 2009 12:53 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
As for a move risking now or later, it depends on your own judgement.
In my opinion, it’s less risky to move him down now than later (when teams need bodies and therefore will be more likely to claim him). Another perk of this is that it frees up some cap space, so if DW wants to make a move at the deadline (admittedly, this will be tough to do), he has a little more cushion to work with.
Fear The Fin: Where Selling Your Soul Is The Likely Solution
by Mr. Plank on Nov 2, 2009 1:01 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Now vs. Later
Given the injury problems the team has, I actually DO find it risky to send him down now, because if he gets picked up, we’re short a warm body for the bench.
IF, there was some unsigned FA out there we could pick up on the cheap who would be game ready, then I guess I’d be all over the potential loss of Staubitz. But I don’t see that happening. So I guess for the moment, we keep him up and hope the ice time with the big club aids his development. He HAS scored some goals, and is a big body.
They're not getting this kind of coverage at "Hockey Night In Canada" folks! - Randy Hahn
by ElvisVF101 on Nov 2, 2009 1:10 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Why not utilize the Worcester shuttle and call up Frazer McLaren then? There’s a large amount of two way contracts in the system.
However, I know what you’re saying in regards to if a guy gets injured in warmups you don’t have someone to plug in. That’s the reason I think it’s likely they keep him around as a healthy scratch all season long.
Fear The Fin: Where Selling Your Soul Is The Likely Solution
by Mr. Plank on Nov 2, 2009 1:17 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
You know, I forgot about Frazer… He makes Staubitz a bit more expendable I suppose.
I do worry who Worcester has then to deal with all the absences. “Depleting” is probably not the right term to use here, but the future very much becomes now as we have a good 9 guys or so (Demers, Joslin, Petrecki, McGinn, Vesce, Ferrerio, Coture, Staubitz, McLaren) who are very much a part of the current Sharks picture.
I include Joslin and Petrecki because we’re awfully thin on the blue line. Organizational depth is an issue for the team, given how much we have invested in our big guns (Joe, Patty, Nabby, Boyle, Heatley). With Pavs and Seto due for raises, and a desire to resign Manny to some sort of respectable contract next year, I don’t know where we are going to get that depth from, unless we deal someone like Vlasic for parts.
They're not getting this kind of coverage at "Hockey Night In Canada" folks! - Randy Hahn
by ElvisVF101 on Nov 2, 2009 1:25 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Eh..
That’s something that the baby Sharks are use to dealing with, and really all AHL teams in general.
I think it puts a lot more pressure on our goalies down there, and right now that’s what I want. Seems like Stalock is really thriving in that environment.
by Evilducks on Nov 2, 2009 1:29 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I think I’d rather Ferriero got sent down than Staubitz. Staubby hasn’t looked terrible. The 4th line has actually looked pretty decent lately. And he works well as a scratch/injury or Shelley replacement.
But yeah, as Evilducks said, rather see Ferriero sent down than McGinn. But that’s just personal preference. Both have been solid.
Sometimes the impossible can become possible if you're AWESOME!
by ZeroIndulgence on Nov 2, 2009 12:39 PM PST via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
McGinn>Ferriero>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Staubitz.
Fear the Fin: Sharing Joe Thornton's love of wooly mammoths since 2009.
by That'll Cheech You on Nov 2, 2009 12:40 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I was thinking of rookies that can go down without waivers at the time, but I’m with TCY and Plank on Staubitz, that guy makes some of the most retarded plays.
Sure, the flying goal was pretty nice, but he needs to stay out of the box on easily avoidable penalties.
by Evilducks on Nov 2, 2009 1:14 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I’m working on a little ditty for later this week on penalties drawn vs. taken per 60 minutes, but Staubitz has been terrible in this regard. You can’t have a fourth line putting you on the kill at the rate he has been, especially with their limited ice time.
Fear The Fin: Where Selling Your Soul Is The Likely Solution
by Mr. Plank on Nov 2, 2009 12:44 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I have noticed Staubitz taking a few stupid penalties. Which is bad. But I’ve also noticed the 4th line providing some good energy minutes earlier in the games, and even chipping in with a few goals. Not saying that replacing Staubitz with someone else would change that or not, but I guess I’m just not as down on Staubitz as everyone else is.
Sometimes the impossible can become possible if you're AWESOME!
by ZeroIndulgence on Nov 2, 2009 1:38 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Level of competition
I would caution that the 4th line looked good against Carolina, yes. Carolina is not very good right now. But in the tight game against LA, we didn’t see the 4th line AT ALL in the third period, and only sparingly in the second. We were at home that game, and Todd had a chance to match up, and he never rolled those guys over the boards.
Again, as I said in the gameday thread, LA didn’t roll their 4th line either, so, take that for what you will. But it would be nice to have a 4th line that the coaching staff has some trust in. I personally feel the coaching staff doesn’t completely trust Brad. Hence my desire to flip him for someone they might, someone who might also better compliment Coture.
Of course, since Logan can’t score hat tricks ever game with Staubby on his wing, he’s clearly a bust.
They're not getting this kind of coverage at "Hockey Night In Canada" folks! - Randy Hahn
by ElvisVF101 on Nov 2, 2009 1:49 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I wouldn’t build a 4th line around Couture. He’s not a 4th line center, and never will be. A productive 4th line would most likely have Nichol or Malhotra at the center of it…grinders/energy guys/sandpaper, if you will.
And I’ll never buy the “well, the 4th line didn’t play in the 3rd period of a tied game” argument as one why we should revamp it. In a salary cap world where there’s only so much talent you can fit under the cap, your lower lines are usually going to be made up of players who don’t cost as much but fill a specific role. I’d venture to guess that most teams wouldn’t roll their 4th line out in a close or tied game…they’d want their best players out there. Besides, the 4th line looked pretty good against Colorado too…and Colorado has been pretty darned good.
The 4th line, at least in my eyes, and besides the stupid penalties, has done pretty much exactly what I expected it to. It’s been giving some good, tough minutes early in a game, hasn’t been a liability on defense, and has even chipped in a few goals. And Staubitz has been a part of that.
Sometimes the impossible can become possible if you're AWESOME!
by ZeroIndulgence on Nov 2, 2009 2:33 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I agree with you that Couture is not a 4th liner. But if he’s going to play with the big club this season, barring about 3-4 key injuries, he’s going to be relegated to the 4th line. Hence my desire to have someone a bit more skilled than Staubitz out there.
I’ll agree that the cap limits who you can put out on the ice, and for Brad’s price tag, I don’t see anyone out there who is a significant upgrade. ’
I don’t expect to see Staubitz and Shelley in the third period of many tie games, but they also weren’t getting many minutes in the second. That still troubles me, because it just means more minutes for the big guns.
It’s early, and I expect the 4th line to build some chemistry and contributing more minutes. I just am still more skeptical than you at this point as to the level of their contributions, Staubby’s goals notwithstanding. The dumb penalties concern me, but if they stop becoming a trend, that worry is easily put to rest.
They're not getting this kind of coverage at "Hockey Night In Canada" folks! - Randy Hahn
by ElvisVF101 on Nov 2, 2009 2:58 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Fair enough.
I don’t see Couture sticking around once Pavs gets back…as evidenced by today’s rumors. He still needs work.
Sometimes the impossible can become possible if you're AWESOME!
by ZeroIndulgence on Nov 2, 2009 6:17 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Staubitz
I agree. I do understand the worry about stupid penalties, but they seem to be getting a little bit less often than when he was brand new to the league. Outside of the penalties, staubitz, along with the rest of the 4th line, has been playing with a ton of energy and creating plenty of momentum for the other guys on the team. not to mention a few goals recently.
Also, what better player do you expect to be able to put out there for $500,000?
by the tank on Nov 3, 2009 12:10 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, I didn’t want to burst your bubble, but I was editing the fanshot right after you said how excited you were.
My bad.
Fear the Fin: Sharing Joe Thornton's love of wooly mammoths since 2009.
by That'll Cheech You on Nov 2, 2009 10:46 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
It’s Monday, you’d think I would know better
by Section223 on Nov 2, 2009 10:58 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Sound the alarm!
Wait, shit!
I think this is just short term cap strategy— with the Sharks on the east coast they can afford to reassign guys for a day or two.
Fear The Fin: Where Selling Your Soul Is The Likely Solution
by Mr. Plank on Nov 2, 2009 11:01 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
I think Doug Wilson is becoming the worlds foremost expert on how to finagle even the tiniest amount of cap room.
by Evilducks on Nov 2, 2009 11:48 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
That was my thought, exactly
Fear the Fin....where being an old guy isn't all bad, and the 2nd round can be bad on the heart
by Dave Valentine on Nov 2, 2009 12:05 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
that’s the only way this makes sense considering Worcester doesn’t even play again til Friday.
Oh, so that's where you edit your signature
by Teas on Nov 2, 2009 12:41 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
is it just me, or does this seem like a scheme to give Pavs and Seto less games played so their raises aren’t so big after this season??? I’m on board with it. The team has won 5 in a row now without them, the Worcester kids are getting some valuable experience up with the big boys, Pavs and Seto will most likely sign for less because of the games missed due to injury…
"Chocolate?! This is doo-doo baby!"
by c.perez on Nov 2, 2009 1:25 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
There was that weird report...
…said that Tanya Harding was seen in attendance at Sharks practices…
They're not getting this kind of coverage at "Hockey Night In Canada" folks! - Randy Hahn
by ElvisVF101 on Nov 2, 2009 1:26 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
If you can skate you can play right?
We just traded who for who?!
by BawLa on Nov 3, 2009 1:29 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Seto
How many games has Seto missed?
I’m thinking he gets dumped onto LTIR soon if he’s not even on the ice right now for cap savings.
by Evilducks on Nov 2, 2009 1:27 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
He’s missed four games.
I’m all for giving these guys the most time to recover at this stage of the season.
Fear The Fin: Where Selling Your Soul Is The Likely Solution
by Mr. Plank on Nov 2, 2009 1:38 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I’m all for anything that makes sure they are 100% healthy to win the Cup this year … :)
Ever get the feeling we are on a collision course with reality? (boycott Hollywood!)
by ang6666 on Nov 2, 2009 2:26 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, I’m with you.
I think you’re required to miss 10 games to go on LTIR and I know they can do it retroactively. So, he’s almost half way there and isn’t even skating with the team? Sounds like he’ll be on LTIR by the weekend.
by Evilducks on Nov 2, 2009 2:29 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, that’s the same reason I wanted Pavelski on the IR (and I think you were in the same boat way back when).
Weird that they haven’t done it yet.
Fear The Fin: Where Selling Your Soul Is The Likely Solution
by Mr. Plank on Nov 2, 2009 2:34 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I think McLellan and the training staff is being optimistic on the length of his injury.
Also, with retroactive being possible I don’t think they’re in a big hurry. With Pav’s and Mitchell already off the books for their injuries they pretty much have the room to do what they want with call ups.
by Evilducks on Nov 2, 2009 3:21 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
really retroactively?
so if Pavs sat out for the minimum required but wasn’t formally placed on LTIR, DW can come back and “delete” the salary hit later?
That’s so cool, it’s almost like cheating.
...Thornton to Murray. HE SCORES!!! DOUGLAS MURRAY! With his first goal of the year. What's he doing way up there??? - Randy Hahn
by DownRUpLYB on Nov 2, 2009 4:47 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
It’s almost like… entering down, right, up, left, Y, B.
Fear The Fin: Where Selling Your Soul Is The Likely Solution
by Mr. Plank on Nov 2, 2009 6:12 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I prefer to think of it as entering “Power Overwhelming” and “Show Me the Money”
They're not getting this kind of coverage at "Hockey Night In Canada" folks! - Randy Hahn
by ElvisVF101 on Nov 3, 2009 9:34 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
It’s almost like… entering down, right, up, left, Y, B.
yup. it’s the code for Street Fighter II on the SNES that allowed you to play mirror matches. except R and L are actually the trigger buttons, not d-pad inputs.
to me, this was much more significant than the more popular up up down down left right left right B A code. but i digress…
...Thornton to Murray. HE SCORES!!! DOUGLAS MURRAY! With his first goal of the year. What's he doing way up there??? - Randy Hahn
by DownRUpLYB on Nov 3, 2009 11:21 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Especially since we seem to be able to win consistantly without them right now. Let them heal so they aren’t dealing with it all season.
Sometimes the impossible can become possible if you're AWESOME!
by ZeroIndulgence on Nov 2, 2009 2:34 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I think even if we weren’t winning right now I’d still argue that they should let them fully heal. It would be a lot harder to get the words out, but I’d still want them recouping at the end of the day than rushing back.
It’s November, there aren’t any ‘must win’ games yet.
by Evilducks on Nov 2, 2009 3:23 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Fair point. Just makes it easier when we’re winning.
Sometimes the impossible can become possible if you're AWESOME!
by ZeroIndulgence on Nov 2, 2009 6:12 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
McGinn's a douche
and Couture’s a bust. It all makes sense folks…..
by idunno723 on Nov 2, 2009 3:24 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
and Nabby is washed up….
We just traded who for who?!
by BawLa on Nov 3, 2009 1:31 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Staubitz...
I agree. I do understand the worry about stupid penalties, but they seem to be getting a little bit less often than when he was brand new to the league. Outside of the penalties, staubitz, along with the rest of the 4th line, has been playing with a ton of energy and creating plenty of momentum for the other guys on the team. not to mention a few goals recently.
Also, what better player do you expect to be able to put out there for $500,000?
by the tank on Nov 3, 2009 12:11 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
For 500,000, I’d expect that you could get a high energy player who avoids stupid penalties. Staubitz may have the energy, but I don’t know who you’ve been watching… He’s rolling at a clip of at least 1 bad penalty a game.
I’ve always been surprised in peoples love for players who fight. Yeah, it’s cool. Yeah, I love watching people get Staubitzed. But he (and Shelley) are such liabilities when it comes to taking penalties. Staubitz has improved, a little, but he’s going to need to take big strides to show me he’s worth his spot on the team.
The flying goal was cool. But the dumb ass interference penalty is what stuck out in my mind.
Fear the Fin: Sharing Joe Thornton's love of wooly mammoths since 2009.
by That'll Cheech You on Nov 3, 2009 6:55 AM PST via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
Seconded
With a caveat or two.
For $500,000 at the beginning of the season, yes, I’d expect an energy player who stays out of the box.
15 odd games in, I think that player is a bit harder to find without a “move” of some kind being made.
A part of me thinks Brad can be that player, but he needs ice time to do that. You’ve got me as to whether he’s better served getting that ice time in Worcester or with the Big Club.
Plank was probably right that Brad’s spot could very easily go to Frazer McLaren. I’m still just worried that we’re really relying very heavily on Worcester. If those guys start getting injured, we’re in big trouble. For the sake of bodies on the bench, we need Staubitz to step up. He’s shown some flashes of good, and some flashes of bad. If we can get some consistency out of him, I think we’d all feel better.
They're not getting this kind of coverage at "Hockey Night In Canada" folks! - Randy Hahn
by ElvisVF101 on Nov 3, 2009 9:33 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I think you expect too much from a 13th forward/usual healthy scratch kind of player. Yes, 1 bad penalty a game can’t continue, but that is a hella small sample size this season. I’d venture to guess he would be under that if we had a full season of sample to go with (although I haven’t looked anything up…maybe he is actually taking one bad penalty every game throughout his entire career). Either way, we aren’t going to have a player with third line skills (defensively mostly, but also in smarts and hockey sense) on the healthy scratch list most nights to be around just in case of injury. Staubitz was the healthy scratch at the beginning of the year before all the injuries, and I’d expect him to head back there once everyone gets back.
Sure, I’d love to be able to stack a roster with players who are all awesome and can all play defense and who all never screw up mentally. But realistically, no one can afford that under the cap, and most players who fit that bill want full time roles. I don’t mind Staubitz filling in when we need it. If he can limit the bad penalties to less than his current small sample size has shown, then there’s really nothing to worry about.
Sometimes the impossible can become possible if you're AWESOME!
by ZeroIndulgence on Nov 3, 2009 10:27 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
As a proud fan of guys who beat up guys...
it’s not like we’re fans of them because they take penalties!
Okay, why I like Staubitz and Shelley? I just love what they do. Sticking up for teammates and willing to get their but kicked. All of this plus they have a job that not many appreciate. If you met either of them they’re some of the nicest guys on the team. Example. Them beating up guys is just icing on the cake!
I see what you mean btw. They’re a liability and all but what I like about them is they do their job and don’t get much recognition for it. Sort of like an underdog. Kind of. Not really. A little bit. Yeah…
by idunno723 on Nov 3, 2009 9:53 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Certain photos copyright © 2010 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
