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History Suggests Sharks Should Stay Mostly Intact

“Whose fault is it?”

“Who do we get rid of so this doesn’t happen again?” 

A natural knee-jerk reaction from fans and media, after a painful postseason flameout, is to find players and/or coaches to blame for our distress.  The thinking is that something needs to change or we’re doomed to repeat past failures.  The problem with knee-jerk reactions is they mostly lack reasonable analysis.  I don’t claim to be a hockey expert, but I do know that Joe Thornton and Patrick Marleau are fantastic players, even if they haven’t produced the playoff results that we expect.  I also know that the Sharks aren’t the first team to experience repeated playoff failures.  In fact, there have been other teams who have overcome postseason disappointments to eventually become Stanley Cup champions.     

Star-divide

Before the Sharks, there have been seven top seeds who have been ousted in the opening round, and four of them eventually won Stanley Cups within three years after their ouster.  Okay, that’s not a really high percentage, but the 1994 Red Wings, the 1997 Devils, the 1998 Devils, and the 2006 Red Wings, also had a solid group of good players in the prime of their careers, and instead of trading away key players, they kept most of their group intact. 

 

The ‘94 Wings team that lost to the Sharks bears the greatest resemblance to the 2009 Sharks.  They were also going through years of playoff futility.  That series loss was the sixth consecutive year they were eliminated, and Detroit fans were bent because their team hadn’t won a Cup since 1955.  The Wings had players such as Sergei Federov, Niklas Lidstrom, Darren McCarty, and Vyacheslov Kozlov.  All players who were also on their Cup winning teams in 1997 and 1998.  Also on that team was Steve Yzerman.  They all love Yzerman in Detroit, but he wasn’t always beloved, because he was a part of the previous playoff ousters.  There were also questions about his leadership.  In fact, when the Wings lost to the Sharks in ‘94, Yzerman was 29 years old.  The same age as Thornton and Marleau.  Sure, those Wings championship teams made some key additions, such as Brendan Shanahan, Kris Draper, and Tomas Holmstrom, but they didn’t upset their core that was still in the prime of their careers.       

The ‘06 Detroit team that won the Presidents Cup trophy and lost to Edmonton in the first round, made it to the conference finals in ‘07, and won the Cup last year.  Nearly all of the key players from last year’s title team played on that disappointing team in 2006.  Guys such as Lidstrom, Draper, Holmstrom, Pavel Datsyuk, Henrik Zetterberg, Kirk Maltby, and Chris Chelios.  They did make a significant addition in Dominik Hasek (although Osgood was clearly the top goalie in the playoffs) after the 2006 season and Brian Rafalski last year, but other than those two, the ‘06 and ‘08 teams were nearly identical.         

The 1998 and 1999 Devils both lost in the opening round despite being the top seed, and went on to win the Cup in 2000.  Again, they mostly stuck with their core players, such as Bobby Holik, Randy McKay, Patrick Elias, Petr Sykora, Scott Stevens, Jason Arnott, and, of course, Martin Brodeur.  There were some good additions (like Claude Lemieux, Rafalski, and Alexander Mogilny), similar to ones that Doug Wilson will have to make, but the key players remained.  They were patient, trusted their system, and didn’t blow up the team.  

What about these Sharks?  Well, other than Thornton and Marleau being 29, Jonathan Cheechoo (28), Ryane Clowe (26, but a free agent), Christian Ehrhoff (26), Marcel Goc (25), Joe Pavelski (24), Milan Michalek (24), Torrey Mitchell (24), and Devin Setoguchi (22) have also yet to hit 30.  The Sharks may have to get a little younger (particularly on defense) and deeper, but Wilson and the organization have always done a pretty good job of developing prospects. 

One player I wouldn’t mind the Sharks dealing is Evgeni Nabokov.  He’s 33 years old and has never been able to put the Sharks on his back in the postseason.  Lesser goaltenders, like Jonas Hiller, have carried their teams to series wins.  Plus, there are enough teams (perhaps the Avalanche) who are looking for good goaltending, that the Sharks may be able to fetch a solid winger or defenseman in return.  The Sharks are deep in goalie prospects, and it’s not like we’ve seen a drop-off from Nabokov to Brian Boucher these last few seasons anyway.    

This team is about the current group of guys who still have the ability to bring a Cup to San Jose.  Throughout this offseason, the Sharks are going to think about the times they were bullied in this series.  They’re going to think about their failures to score and their failure to consistently play with a killer instinct.  They will have plenty of motivation to take into next season.  With most of the key figures intact, and with the addition of a few new faces, they should be poised to make another run at a Stanley Cup next year.  A championship is still very much within grasp.    

This item was created by a member of this blog's community and is not necessarily endorsed by Fear The Fin.

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good perspective, thank you

i had no idea torrey mitchell was that old

by a10dency2ask on Apr 29, 2009 8:59 AM PDT reply actions  

yeah

why’s he so old?
he needs to be younger or something

by Brian5517209 on May 5, 2009 6:34 PM PDT up reply actions  

Very nice article

resident cartoonist @couchtarts.blogspot.com

by CTGray on Apr 29, 2009 9:45 AM PDT reply actions  

Great stuff

the comparisons are right on.

Fear the Fin....where being an old guy isn't all bad, and the 2nd round can be bad on the heart

by Dave Valentine on Apr 29, 2009 9:52 AM PDT reply actions  

great perspective

thanks for the history- always levels the waters a bit.

i for one would hate to see guys like marleau and thornton go, i think especially marleau, as the guy epitomizes the sharks. flies under the radar, but kills you when he has the chance.

i dont think core personnel changes are in order (save for maybe a goalie), but i do think someone like clowe or maybe boyle could be a better fit with the C on the jersey.

"I want this team to be tough, smart and prepared to play well under pressure...Everybody here in this organization is going to be held accountable to do their job — their piece of the puzzle to make this team a competitor for a championship every season." J-Mac

by Jay Fin Anderson on Apr 29, 2009 10:04 AM PDT reply actions  

I dig Clowe's style

but he doesn’t strike me as a Capitan at this time.

resident cartoonist @couchtarts.blogspot.com

by CTGray on Apr 29, 2009 11:20 AM PDT up reply actions  

ah, excuse me

Queen…were you speaking with a French accent…or just another typo?

Fear the Fin....where being an old guy isn't all bad, and the 2nd round can be bad on the heart

by Dave Valentine on Apr 29, 2009 1:17 PM PDT up reply actions  

I'll go with accent

mon capitan!

resident cartoonist @couchtarts.blogspot.com

by CTGray on Apr 29, 2009 1:26 PM PDT up reply actions  

And for the record (I hate saying that)

I like Clowe a lot. As for him being captain (Or capitan, depending on your European persuasion) I havent seen anything from him which would lead me to believe he would make a better captain than Marleau. Which is why I asked for why Denver felt that Clowe should get a look in.

I dont recall seeing him talking to refs, or being helpfully vocal. So why would you make Clowe Captain?

by Morti on Apr 29, 2009 5:00 PM PDT up reply actions  

i think its his demeanor, the way he plays,

his style. his willingness to get the the dirty areas. he is first on and last off the ice most of the time for games and practices. he has bad games but never takes games off, meaning he might trip over his own feet but only because he is trying 110%.

you dont see him talking to the refs because that is what the captain and assistant captains do. anyone else in the refs face can become an unsportsmanlike conduct penalty.

hockey is unique in that the captain is more than a symbolic gesture, a guy who calls the coin toss. the captain is really the guy who sets the mood for the team. all season, we have heard from this incredibly gifted and very deep team that they lacked killer instinct (dan boyle actually came out said said exactly that). maybe a guy with a great deal of talent and a little more edge than the current captain would help to change things.

dont misread here- i am by no means suggesting marleau needs to go. far from it, he is a significant part of this team. i think though his role has lead the team to be a bit soft though.

"I want this team to be tough, smart and prepared to play well under pressure...Everybody here in this organization is going to be held accountable to do their job — their piece of the puzzle to make this team a competitor for a championship every season." J-Mac

by Jay Fin Anderson on Apr 29, 2009 6:47 PM PDT up reply actions  

Thank you

I appreciate you taking the time to let me know your view.

I like Clowe a lot. He brings a lot of toughness to the table that we absolutely need. I could see him in the Assitant role, but not being in the locker room, I cant see a big aspect of how Captains and assistants are chosen.

I think he needs to be kept around, and I’d love to see him with more responsbillity.

by Morti on Apr 30, 2009 10:48 AM PDT up reply actions  

Very good stuff.

Fear The Fin: Where Selling Your Soul Is The Likely Solution

by Mr. Plank on Apr 29, 2009 2:14 PM PDT reply actions  

I will have to admit

after the other night’s misfortune, I’ve been looking for something to improve my optimism. I always get nervous when people talk about blowing up the core of the team, precisely because we have such a solid core of players. I would be heartbroken if Patty were dealt, because he reminds me of myself (quiet and reserved, but can get things done when necessary), and he’s been my favorite hockey player since I knew what hockey was. Seeing the hard evidence for keeping the core together has given me something to be optimistic about, so thank you.

by Chicago Shark on Apr 29, 2009 3:12 PM PDT reply actions  

Someone should send this

to Purdy….jerkoff

Fear the Fin....where being an old guy isn't all bad, and the 2nd round can be bad on the heart

by Dave Valentine on Apr 29, 2009 4:09 PM PDT up reply actions  

Great stuff. Rec'd

It takes a big man to cry and it takes a bigger man to laugh at that man. -Jamie Baker

by Lurker Shark on Apr 29, 2009 7:26 PM PDT reply actions  

excellent

I haven’t read much about the role of luck in hockey, or the crapshootedness of the playoffs. After the Sharks were ousted, I read (somewhere) that this is the ninth time since ‘94 that a first seed has lost to an eighth seed — that’s more than 25% of the time. Misery loves company, they say, and there’s plenty of it as you point out.

by phastphill on Apr 30, 2009 7:22 AM PDT reply actions  

I disagree. The Sharks are not deep in goalie prospects.

10 years ago, the Sharks were over-flowing with 4 very good goalie prospects. But it takes not just a talented goaltender, but an effective goalie coach as well. Unfortunately, the Sharks lost the best several years back…

Currently, none of the goalies in the system would be ready to be a starter next year. Maybe Greiss could handle the occasional back-up duties, but I’m not confident in handing the #1 job to Boucher. Bouch’s stats were impressive early-on b/c he played fewer games, played against poorer opposition or the Sharks defense played better in front of him. In March when the Sharks struggled, as did Boucher. Maybe he’s a Ty Conklin and will be able to turn it around… or maybe he’s not. If he’s not, would you trust it to a rookie goalie? It just makes more sense to allow Greiss and Sexsmith get more time in the minors and develop rather than warm the bench.

It’ll take several more years to find out if Greiss, Sexsmith, Sateri, Stalock, or Dakers can be the man. As it is, it makes no sense to trade Nabby next season when he’ll be in his final year under contract.

Where hockey injuries in San Diego are thumb blisters from playing too much NHL 09

by Will Bulldozer on May 2, 2009 12:43 AM PDT reply actions  

The Sharks are deep in Goalie Prospects...

And you said it yourself. Granted, none of them would inspire confidence if they took the job… but that shouldn’t affect Doug’s decision process. Still, we have five solid prospects.

Nabby’s value will never be higher than it is right now. Because of this, he should be shopped. He’s not worth the contract right now, but maybe some team would still be willing to give us something significant in return for him.

This does leave a hole at goalie, as neither Greiss or Boucher is capable of playing the big chunk of an 82 game season. There are, however, a glut of average goalies on the free agent market (Biron, Fernandez, Roloson) in addition to some good goalies stuck in bad situations (Halak, Rinne/Ellis).

Fear the Fin: Where we just have to want it more!

by TCY on May 4, 2009 7:20 AM PDT up reply actions  

Oh...

And if Nabby were to be traded, I’d look to Philly. They have a glut of prospects (Van Riemsdyk would be the gem) that I would love to get my hands on.

Fear the Fin: Where we just have to want it more!

by TCY on May 4, 2009 7:22 AM PDT up reply actions  

aside from the obvious concerns

I also have this fear that if DW moves Nabby, it will bite us in the ass. Vesa’s trade didn’t end up doing that but I just have this feeling…

I trust DW to do what he feels is best for the team, even if his decisions ultimately confuse me. That’s why he gets the big bucks and I’m writing this while sitting on my couch.

resident cartoonist @couchtarts.blogspot.com

by CTGray on May 4, 2009 10:42 AM PDT up reply actions  

You mean sorta like when Kipprusoff was traded, and he went on to win the Vezina and lead the Flames to the Finals and all that. Although, getting Vlasic with the second round pick that was sent back makes the trade look a bit better.

by mymclife on May 4, 2009 2:36 PM PDT up reply actions  

Yea... but Kipper was in his mid 20's when he was traded.

It was a calculated risk that Wilson took, he was betting that Kipper’s potential would never come through. And yeah, he was pretty wrong.

But even if Nabby were to come around and have a great year next year… he’s going to be 34 next season and most likely doesn’t have the number of solid seasons left in him that Kipprusoff did at the time.

Fear the Fin: Where we just have to want it more!

by TCY on May 4, 2009 3:04 PM PDT up reply actions  

Believe me, I’m not saying its the same, because at the time the Sharks had both Nabokov and Toskala as well as Kipper. And Kipper, IMO, hasn’t been that much better than Nabby over the years. He’s just more accomplished.

And if the Sharks can find a Strelow-esque goaltending coach that’ll help Nabby with his five hole, I could see him return to last year’s form.

by mymclife on May 4, 2009 3:28 PM PDT up reply actions  

only in Kipper

resident cartoonist @couchtarts.blogspot.com

by CTGray on May 4, 2009 4:38 PM PDT up reply actions  

key slip

Only in Kipper’s case, he couldn’t win the starting job. They must have something in the water in Calgary. ;)

resident cartoonist @couchtarts.blogspot.com

by CTGray on May 4, 2009 4:39 PM PDT up reply actions  

Kipper really hasn’t been better than Nabokov. He got hot and took his team on a run but since then hasn’t outperformed Nabokov. I would say hold on to Nabokov, it’s a terrible recipe to put an unproven/unreliable goalie in front of a team that is set to contend (If you disagree you may be interested in Jose Theodore).

As for trading to PHI, they have no cap room so I don’t see how they accommodate Nabokov’s salary unless you take significant salary back. I don’t know what they’d give but I’m not sure they would part with anything you need, unless you are interested in Briere.

As for the original post, great job, you clearly did a lot of work. I think the ‘08 DET team and the Devils teams are a little different just because at the time those teams lost in the first round the core of those teams already had won a Cup with that organization. It’s easier to maintain faith in the face of failure when you have seen that it is possible to win with those guys. That said, the ‘94 Wings is such a strong parallel I would really take a lot of confidence from that. I really enjoy how the Sharks play so I hope they don’t get blown up and I also don’t think it’s likely.

by Fehr and Balanced on May 9, 2009 10:08 PM PDT up reply actions  

Not interested in Theodore...

But PHI has a few of UFA’s this year (Hatcher, Knuble, both current goalies), so they don’t really have cap issues unless they resign them.

And yea, Kipper hasn’t been better lately, but for two years after the trade he was a much better goalie. He’s come back to earth since then.

Fear the Fin: Where we just have to want it more!

by TCY on May 10, 2009 9:16 AM PDT up reply actions  

Even with those guys coming off, and assuming Rathje won’t play at all, the PHI still have over 50 mill committed to the cap next year so they still need to send players back your way. They’ll probably try to move Lupul but if I were SJS I would make them give up Hartnell.

by Fehr and Balanced on May 11, 2009 9:39 AM PDT up reply actions  

If you want my opinion on the subject, you can browse here.

Basically what it comes down to is a) getting a proven NHL goaltender this offseason and b) making sure we get younger in the process. I’m sure we’ll take a look at the pros and cons of trading Nabokov more this offseason, because he will be able to yield a high return.

Fear The Fin: Where Selling Your Soul Is The Likely Solution

by Mr. Plank on May 11, 2009 11:03 AM PDT up reply actions  

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