Notes on Couture from Monday's Rookie Skate, Petrecki fools around and gets a Gordie Howe Hat Trick
Petrecki was amazing in his first "pro" game, posting a Gordie Howe hat trick.
In addition, Couture was taking some heat from the posters on WTC, so I posted my breakdown of his tournament so far and though I would share here as well:
"I’m still surprised at people’s criticism of Couture, especially after these two games. Granted, I only went to Monday’s skate, so I don’t know how he looked last night. But if he played like he did on Monday, fans should be happy.
No, he didn’t score a point in either game. I admit, that’s a knock on him playing against inferior competition. However, he did so many impressive things on Monday that you look for from a top prospect. He won almost every single faceoff he took, he saw teammates and made crisp passes, had amazing vision, stripped pucks from any opponent around him, blocked shots, played big minutes on the kill (including playing as the sole forward on a 3-5 disadvantage) and quarterbacked the powerplay. His shot is also improved, and probably would have scored a PP goal if his stick didn’t break on a shot between the circles in the 2nd.
Admittedly, the skating does need work. But sometimes I feel like people rehash old scouting reports to knock on a guy even though he’s made significant improvement. His stride is much stronger than it was even last year with Ottawa/Worcester, and he often dragged multiple opponents through the zone with him (drawing penalties in the process). He needs more work skating on the rush, but his footwork was impressive in the offensive zone when the game slowed, often dancing around defenders in limited space.
It would be easy to see how good he is if he scored multiple points. But I don’t see how any one who watched him could think that he was disappointing. I expect him to compete strongly for a spot on the roster."
[Plank Update 4:22 PM]: Yes, that's Minnesota time. Anyways, here's my take on this, as I mentioned in the comments:
I have no idea why everyone is getting up in arms over a player who hasn’t even seen AHL competition yet. It’s always been San Jose’s philosophy that they can teach skating as long as the kid has good hockey sense. That’s how Douglas Murray and Joe Pavelski made the team, and I assume that’s the philosophy with Couture.
I also have no idea why everyone is quick to judge him off one or two games, games that most of the people with an opinion didn’t even see. This game occurred against very young competition, with most of these players probably seeing limited NHL time if any. It’s a goddamn rookie game. Let’s not hastily rush to conclusions here, regardless of where you end up (Couture is a bust, Couture is the next number one center etc.)
That being said, I’ll trust Max Giese, PJ Swenson, and TCY over Garner every day. There’s a reason I rarely read anything that guy writes.
Anyways, if Couture is defined as a playmaker (which every report indicates he is), there could be a reason he didn’t score*. When you’re playing with players for the first time, you’re going to your areas of responsibility and not taking as many chances as you would normally. A defenseman isn’t going to cut backdoor because he doesn’t trust his forward to replace him at the blueline. Forwards aren’t going to be moving as much off the puck because they’re not sure where their linemates are headed. A guy like Couture (just like Pavelski and Thornton) relies on creativity and an awareness of where his teammates are going to be in order to thrive.
*I don’t even care about this, but everyone seems to be up in arms about it.
As for Couture’s future with the team, I would prefer if he spent the year in Worcester barring a major injury down the middle. There’s no need to a) throw him on a checking line or b) scratch him most nights and deprive him of ice time in Worcester. We already have three bonafide top six centers (Thornton, Marleau, Pavelski), as well as Mitchell who will hold down the third line. You can maybe move Pavs to second line right wing if the injury bug hits like last season and throw Logan there, but now you’ve got two similar guys trying to do the same thing in the offensive zone.
Keep him in Worcester this season, let him mature and play against AHL competition for a full season, consider him if the injury bug hits and/or you want to give him NHL ice time for a couple games since he has a two-way, and then re-evaluate the organization’s depth chart next offseason.
6 months ago
That'll Cheech You
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Comments
Don't listen to WTC commentators,
they’re crazies. Also to avoid more crazies, don’t go to Bleacher Report. They’re upset with Couture because he was a number one draft pick and isn’t Ovechkin, Crosby, or Kane yet.
by idunno723 on Sep 9, 2009 7:21 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I feel the same way
the WTC commentors are pretty nuts, much more irrational and quick to anger than the usually laid back folks here on FtF. I would take your analysis over theirs any day.
by Chicago Shark on Sep 9, 2009 8:26 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Haha, thanks.
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by That'll Cheech You on Sep 9, 2009 9:21 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oh I don’t…. I just see “Couture continues to dissapoint” and take it as “Couture didn’t score, so I assume he sucks”, and feel like posting.
I brought the discussion back here, though.
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by That'll Cheech You on Sep 9, 2009 9:21 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Scoring
Do you think it has more to do with the lack of scoring than with his hockey ability? I get the feeling people are expecting a Kane type of player (fast, flashy and all offense), which is not at all what Couture is.
by Evilducks on Sep 9, 2009 10:33 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think when you get a 7th overall pick...
People expect him to score right away. Players like Kane (who’s main asset was speed) will more easily score because it’s part of their game from the get go. I think people thought Couture would be lighting it up in the NHL by now. But like you said, it’s not his game at all. He’s a 3 zone player with great hockey sense. People expected Marleau, and it looks like they’ll get Pavelski. I’m quite happy with that.
The main knock was his skating (interestingly enough, like Pavelski), but that’s something that is fixable. It just takes time. If you look at his body and his vision, though, you can see that he’ll be an NHL player, and a good one. His skating has improved, and will continue too.
I think he could be a 70-80 point player in the NHL, and I think he’s going to surprise people.
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by That'll Cheech You on Sep 9, 2009 10:48 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Pavelski
So, with that in mind, is that going to make Pavelski expendable soon? We only have room for so many Centers and assuming we keep Joe we also have Mitchell and Pavelski in the top 3. He doesn’t sound like a 4th line guy, maybe he pushes Mitchell to 4 or does that mean we might let Pav’s go (not that I want that by any means). That’s not even considering keeping Marleau around after this year…
by Evilducks on Sep 9, 2009 10:52 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think that Couture and Pavelski will be extremely similar players. I’m assuming that Couture will end up being better, but even still, you could justify having one of them on the 1st line on a non-Thornton team.
If you keep both players, you have to find room for them on the first two lines. You lose some of their offensive effectiveness on the bottom two lines, even though I could see Couture using the body, positioning, and defensive skill in a defensice stopper role.
If you don’t move one to the wing, and Thornton stays, there is a bit of a log jam. There is time, though, and I don’t want to think about any of that right now.
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by That'll Cheech You on Sep 9, 2009 11:05 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Posting at work is bad… 9th pick.
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by That'll Cheech You on Sep 9, 2009 11:46 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
nuts
We’re not that bad… well, okay, I can think of one poster in general that’s pretty terrible. I think for the most part they’re fairly sane.
I asked about Couture because a lot of people seem to have very mixed feelings on Couture. Mike from the Dudes podcast seems very unimpressed, meanwhile PJ at sharkspage really likes him. It’s just a wider variety of opinions that I’m use to from the batch of Sharks bloggers I read.
by Evilducks on Sep 9, 2009 10:32 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Casual hockey fans don’t tend to notice the little things in hockey. Namely, the defensive aspects of a forward, the faceoff win percentages. The casual fan wants glits and glam from their forwards. They want goals and assists and points. It doesn’t matter if the player is doing many other things well.
Therefore, I’m not particularly surprised about the criticism, when all you do is look at the box score after the game.
Sometimes the impossible can become possible if you're AWESOME!
by ZeroIndulgence on Sep 9, 2009 10:51 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
But sometimes I feel like people rehash old scouting reports to knock on a guy even though he’s made significant improvement.
This is really true in all sports and is one of the most annoying things when reading about prospects.
Proud father of Juan Carlos Perez. Think Albert Pujols at a position to be determined.
@#$% Juan Uribe. Dios es grande.
by marcello on Sep 9, 2009 10:52 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Yeah… but I heard he can’t skate!
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by That'll Cheech You on Sep 9, 2009 11:20 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
More, from me...
I think the problem with Couture is that people expected he would be an absolute offensive dynamo (he wasn’t bad though, scoring 1.23 PPG in the OHL), and were surprised when he wasn’t here lighting up the NHL.
Couture will always be more of a Pavelski than a Marleau (Playmaking, Defense first mindset), and it takes players like that time to be NHL ready. When Couture was drafted, he still had maturing to do, and is still only 20. He’s now bigger, and a better skater. His hockey sense is undeniable, and his vision is above average for even the NHL. He blocks shots, kills penalties, and QB’s the powerplay. He will be a solid NHL player.
That being said, he’ll never be an NHL star. He’s not Kane, Malkin, Crosby, etc. But he will have a very solid NHL career as a complete player who plays well in all 3 zones and in all situations (PK,PP,ES)… I can see 70-80 points a season as his peak. I’m fine with that total when it comes with the complete set that Logan brings.
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by That'll Cheech You on Sep 9, 2009 11:09 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Oops, meant 60-70 on the points.
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by That'll Cheech You on Sep 9, 2009 11:19 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think he’ll sniff the NHL this year, but spend most of his time in the AHL. It’ll be interesting to see how he handles himself against other NHL players.
by Evilducks on Sep 9, 2009 11:35 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I agree with this...
Like Setoguchi and McGinn before him, I think it’ll take some up and down before he gets a definite role. Although, I think he could push for playing time which will up the competition for spots and get people motivated… something we didn’t have last year.
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by That'll Cheech You on Sep 9, 2009 11:38 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Garner
Ryan Garner has weighed in on Couture in his latest post and it’s less than favorable, and like I said, the odd dichotomy of views on Couture continues (not that I give Garner much credit in the hockey analysis world…)
by Evilducks on Sep 9, 2009 11:43 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
That’s pretty much what I expected. No points = terrible performance. Remember, Garner once said that we should trade Thornton and line up Pavelski on line one…. yeahhhhhhhhhh.
Whatever, it’s not up to me to argue for Couture. He’ll turn it on eventually.
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by That'll Cheech You on Sep 9, 2009 11:48 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oh I remember that post and thank the stars that Wilson is still our general manager and I don’t live in some horrible alternate universe where Garner has control of the team.
by Evilducks on Sep 9, 2009 1:22 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Going to tonight's rookie game...
Anyone know who will be on the ice today?
by SharksFanTillDeath on Sep 9, 2009 12:29 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I have no idea why everyone is getting up in arms over a player who hasn’t even seen AHL competition yet. It’s always been San Jose’s philosophy that they can teach skating as long as the kid has good hockey sense. That’s how Douglas Murray and Joe Pavelski made the team, and I assume that’s the philosophy with Couture.
I also have no idea why everyone is quick to judge him off one or two games, games that most of the people with an opinion didn’t even see. This game occurred against very young competition, with most of these players probably seeing limited NHL time if any. It’s a goddamn rookie game. Let’s not hastily rush to conclusions here, regardless of where you end up (Couture is a bust, Couture is the next number one center etc.)
That being said, I’ll trust Max Giese, PJ Swenson, and TCY over Garner every day. There’s a reason I rarely read anything that guy writes.
Anyways, if Couture is defined as a playmaker (which every report indicates he is), there could be a reason he didn’t score*. When you’re playing with players for the first time, you’re going to your areas of responsibility and not taking as many chances as you would normally. A defenseman isn’t going to cut backdoor because he doesn’t trust his forward to replace him at the blueline. Forwards aren’t going to be moving as much off the puck because they’re not sure where their linemates are headed. A guy like Couture (just like Pavelski and Thornton) relies on creativity and an awareness of where his teammates are going to be in order to thrive.
*I don’t even care about this, but everyone seems to be up in arms about it.
As for Couture’s future with the team, I would prefer if he spent the year in Worcester barring a major injury down the middle. There’s no need to a) throw him on a checking line or b) scratch him most nights and deprive him of ice time in Worcester. We already have three bonafide top six centers (Thornton, Marleau, Pavelski), as well as Mitchell who will hold down the third line. You can maybe move Pavs to second line right wing if the injury bug hits like last season and throw Logan there, but now you’ve got two similar guys trying to do the same thing in the offensive zone.
Keep him in Worcester this season, let him mature and play against AHL competition for a full season, consider him if the injury bug hits and/or you want to give him NHL ice time for a couple games since he has a two-way, and then re-evaluate the organization’s depth chart next offseason.
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by Mr. Plank on Sep 9, 2009 2:07 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
So well said
Like a boss.
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by That'll Cheech You on Sep 9, 2009 2:09 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I definitely agree with keeping him in the AHL. I don’t know why people want some of these kids brought up and thrown in 4th line roles all the time. I’d rather have a vet like Hinote playing those few minutes, grinding the hell out of the opposition and let our young potential top 6 forwards spend their time in the AHL improving their abilities.
by Evilducks on Sep 9, 2009 2:18 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Over all I was very impressed with the players I saw on Monday. I think there were a few flat shifts (and players), but it was quite obvious that a lot of those guys had great potential. Couture looked pretty dang good IMHO.
by maggie01 on Sep 9, 2009 3:44 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I thought Petrecki was very impressive
and so was Couture. Last night was lots of fun! Definitely kept my hockey withdraws at bay.
Too bad Logan mucked up a breakaway (did anybody else see that?) after he forced a takeaway from the last man coming out of the Ducks’ zone. It was exciting, but he lost hold of the puck (lame!). Also, he was showing a lot of creativity on the rush with all sorts of cool plays (cross and drop passes ftw!).
Petrecki will make one heck of a Shark one day. Seems like an absolute team player.
by 4Czech on Sep 9, 2009 3:56 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
More about Petrecki...
Please. I’m all for Corture but I wanna hear more about Mr. Petrecki. How did he look?…Skating?…Sense?….Toughness?
We just traded who for who?!
by BawLa on Sep 9, 2009 4:02 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Apparently...
Great, great, and great.
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by That'll Cheech You on Sep 9, 2009 4:09 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
From what I saw yesterday
he looked very good. He was playing with a bunch of other rooks but still… a goal, an assist, and a fighting major is a darn good debut. Deserved to wear the “A” on that team, definitely.
Nick was keeping the opposition honest, too, throwing the retaliatory hit on anyone who dared take a run at one of his teammates, including 2 or 3 BIG hits that made the crowd go “OOOOOOOOHHHH!”
I didn’t see him out of position very often, except once when he made sort of a bad pinch instead of backing up at the blue line, which led to an odd man, but Stalock saved the day in net (save of the night, for sure).
Good skater. Not phenomenal, but he stayed where he was supposed to be for the most part which kept him out of trouble. I think a two-way season in Woostah would do him a world of good.
I just wish Petrecki could join the big boys right away, since the Sharks are in need of defensemen. Still, it was refreshing to see a prospect like him in the system.
by 4Czech on Sep 9, 2009 4:25 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sharkspage has more if you’re interested.
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by Mr. Plank on Sep 9, 2009 4:53 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thanks everyone
We just traded who for who?!
by BawLa on Sep 9, 2009 11:59 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs





















