One last look at Niclas Wallin (because Willie Watch is getting old)
by Mr. Plank on Aug 22, 2010 11:40 PM PDT
in Statistical Analysis
Email
PrintWhen I sleep, I sleep like the sun.
Willie Watch came and went this weekend, with no new information except he's expecting to make his decision sometime early this week. Whether or not that happens, who knows. I'm not over him as an acquisition (I would love to see him in teal obviously), but I'm kind of done writing about him until news breaks on where he'll end up. I've flooded the front page with enough material this summer to make the point that I think he's a good player.
Regardless, it's Monday and the Sharks are still looking for a defenseman to fit into that two-three hole. And while I think it's clear that Doug Wilson is looking for an upgrade via trade/free agency, today I'm going to assume he doesn't find a deal to his liking and rolls into 2010-2011 with the blueline that is currently in place.
My rays blanket me and burn everyone.
As I see it, here are the pairings going into next season:
Dan Boyle - Douglas Murray
Marc-Edouard Vlasic - Niclas Wallin
Kent Huskins - Jason Demers
Jay Leach
Not the strongest group of guys to say the least, but similar to last year except the loss of Rob Blake has effectively been replaced by Niclas Wallin.
Boyle and Vlasic are solid players who are legitimate top three guys on just about every team in the NHL. Murray's an average top four guy who started to struggle as the year wore on, but can still get you effective minutes in these kinds of situations against slower opposing players. Huskins is overpaid but more than able to get you serviceable bottom pairing minutes, and Demers is a young kid with a load of offensive talent who should improve defensively with a year under his belt.
These streets I paved in gold never emphasized restraint.
Really, the only guy who is a true question mark in terms of where he will be slotted to play is Niclas Wallin. TCY and I were quite critical of the deal when it was announced earlier this summer, but for the sake of establishing some form of objectivity, let's see if the last three years of his professional career can show us something we missed.
What follows is Wallin's statistics from 2007-2010, with rankings according to how he fared against his teammates in the relevant categories. His 2009-2010 year has been separated into two separate sections.
As always, huge tip of the hat to Behind The Net.
So what does this tell us? 07-08 was an absolute disaster for Wallin, 08-09 was a better one, and 09-10 seems to be somewhere in the middle. I like what I see out of his goals against on ice numbers in relation to his teammates-- he does a good job of holding his own in that regard, and won't be bleeding goals out there. That being said, the fact that he facilitates almost no offense from the backend (GF/ON) and has been a minus player every season is a definite black mark, especially when one considers the quality of competition he sees.
I like the fact that he can kill penalties-- the loss of Rob Blake in this category means you're going to need a veteran to step up and eat some of those minutes, and Wallin's a good guy to get you some shifts on the periphery. He won't be a dynamo, but he'll contribute. Even strength ice time over the last four years tells me that the coaching staff probably won't expect him to play all too much in the top four, if at all, and an increasing age (35 years old) cements that notion.
I am the calloused hands that hope, I pray with sinners and saints.
To summarize, it doesn't appear as if the Sharks will be able to count on Wallin for top four minutes. He's a stretch for this role if the roster remains the same, and San Jose will need to upgrade the blueline at some point this year if they wish to legitimately contend for a Stanley Cup in the spring.
Go Sharks.
125 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
Good analysis Plank. I haven’t looked too deeply into Walin’s numbers because I thought DW wasn’t going to resign him based on how poorly he played for us last year. But considering his injury, I guess we haven’t really seen him play yet. He’ll grow on us as did Huskins.
But if I have one concern about him is that he’s constantly injured. He crossed 70 games mark for regular season just once in his NHL career. What that means is that his spot on the roster will be replaced by Joslin and the likes for 20 or more games a season. Are the young guys ready? What if it’s playoffs like last spring?
I think it’s fair to say DW will acquire another d-man better than Wallin. I gave up hope it’ll be before training camp, since it looks like a bidding war for Mitchell, I can’t see that DW will come out on top because he doesn’t play these games. But someone of that caliber or better will be on the trading block between now and February and Dougie will come through again, even if it costs us another 1st round pick or a high prospect. But I’m fine with this timing – we’ll make playoffs regardless.
It’s how our blue line looks around mid-April is what really matters.
Fear the Fin - where Russians are underappreciated.
I really dont think we are out of the race for Mitchell. He has arguably the best in the west(SJS) and the best in the east(Caps) after him and i get the feeling he wants to stay in the west. i think our chances of signing him or another Dman before training camp is still really good.
The only reason I think we’re not out of the running is because the teams in the running never attract free agents. I don’t think we’ll be outbid by an outlandish offer from any of the 4 teams (the only reason Van won’t is they can’t, or they would have).
"Douglas Murray is a humongous human being." – Drew Remenda
See, here's where I differ.
But someone of that caliber or better will be on the trading block between now and February and Dougie will come through again, even if it costs us another 1st round pick or a high prospect. But I’m fine with this timing – we’ll make playoffs regardless.
I’m really tired of the “our team isn’t finished until the trading deadline” bs we hear every year. Yeah, that’s done well for us. Seriously, hockey is a game that relies as much on familiarity with your teammates and comfort in a system as it does skill and speed. The best player in the world will have an adjustment period when changing teams and systems, and will not be able to play up to their full potential right away. The Sharks have always been active at the deadline…but I ask, which of our deadline acquisitions have ever actually worked out for us? Which of the players that we get at the deadline actually make a difference for us in the playoffs? I can’t recall any…or, none stand out to me.
For once, I’d love for the Sharks to have their pieces in place early in the season, or, ideally, now, so they can go through training camp together, and have time during the season to integrate the new players into the system. I want them all working as a finly tuned machine once the playoffs rolls around, and thats hard to do if you’re relying on an impact player you brought in and has only had a month or so of time with the team.
Z!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Tweet Tweet.
by ZeroIndulgence on Aug 23, 2010 10:27 AM PDT up reply actions
I couldnt agree more. I get so irritated when people think its a good idea to sit back and wait for the deadline acquisitions. I think its a horrible mentality to give up until the trade deadline. Our guys need to work together and build up chemistry and i think that will make them better when playoff roll around.
Disagree
Campbell was an outstanding trade deadline acquisition, as was Craig Rivet. Im not going to argue there weren’t busts as well, but a blanket statement saying acquiring players at the deadline is not beneficial misses the mark. And Joe Thornton wasn’t exactly acquired in the offseason, either.
It is absolutely a good idea to wait for the trade deadline if no good opportunities present themselves in the offseason. I don’t want to say chemistry is hogwash, but I do think that these professional players adjust very quickly to a new team. Most teams don’t keep players together more than a period or two anyways, so even coaches don’t put much stock in it.
If Willie Mitchell is the best Dman available, and DW cant sign him for a song, Id rather he wait until February when Boston is already out of contention again and he snags Zdeno Chara for something crazy like Clowe, Jamal Mayers, and Doug Murray.
Out of contention again? When is this going to happen exactly? Did they lose some big players this season that I didn’t notice?
"Douglas Murray is a humongous human being." – Drew Remenda
Tuuka Rask will not have a .931 save percentage again. Without that, they are on the outside looking in.
Though Nathan Horton is pretty underrated. He will def help the cause, but I would not be shocked for Rask to get Steve Mason disease.
It’s unlikely that team will be riddled with injury and completely incapable of scoring goals again just because they lost Kessel.
Not to mention Thomas may play really well again.
"Douglas Murray is a humongous human being." – Drew Remenda
Well, I guess that makes them still a bubble team
Which means a couple of losing streaks at the beginning of the year as opposed to the end of the year would change the teams philosophy for the year (trade Chara, play Seguin more, etc.). I think that is more likely, but Boston wasn’t really the point of the post, it was more that there are usually better DMen available at the deadline that are available right now. Thus, waiting until one of them comes available would be the wise move.
Tuuka Rask could very easily have a .931 SV% again. He is a very good goaltender. And is only going to get better as he gets more experience at the NHL level.
Z!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Tweet Tweet.
by ZeroIndulgence on Aug 23, 2010 4:29 PM PDT up reply actions
Definitely. Rask is a great young goaltender. I don’t think Boston will be looking to rebuild, or even trade Chara anytime soon.
Here are the last 8 NHL SV% leaders and their save percentage the year after
According to Hockey Reference*
Year Player Y1 Y2
08-09 Tim Thomas .933 .915
07-08 Dan Ellis .924 .900
06-07 N Backstrom .929 .920
05-06 C Huet(!) .929 .916
03-04 Kipper/Roloson .933 .923/.908
02-03 M Turco .932 .915
01-02 J Theodore .931 .908
00-01 M Turco .925 .921
Not only is a SV% of .930 and above incredibly good, it is incredibly hard to repeat. I may have missed somebody, but I don’t think anybody in the 21st century has yet to post two seasons with a .930 or above SV%. Hasek I believe is the last one to do it. Tuuka Rask is a very good goalie, but him and the Bruins should be ecstatic if he can keep his SV % above .920, and I wouldn’t be surprised for it to be in the mid .910’s.
But, again, the point wasn’t the Bruins or Zdeno Chara, I just picked him because he is a pending UFA who will likely be dealt if the Bruins have a bad first couple of months. Ed Jovanovski, Andrei Markov, and (hey!) Craig Rivet are all defensman that would look very good in teal come April and who might be moved if their teams fall out of contention. Most would be better additions than Willie Mitchell in his current state.
*sorry about the lack of table formatting skills :-(
OT (sorry)
Has the Mount Puckmore for SJ been put up yet? If so, can someone please link it? Thanks.
Mitchell or Kaberle?
Let’s say that chemistry isn’t an issue, would Kaberle at the trade deadline be enough if we lose out on Mitchell? Two very different players, but, both are top 4 defensemen, and it is pretty clear that Wallin will likely struggle in that role.
I wanted Kaberle since last trade deadline. I think this would have given us time to know where Kaberle fits, see if we could get him on a reasonable extension, and who knows… maybe things turn out different last year in the playoffs with Kaberle. Also, if we already had Kaberle on the roster, we would have a much better chance of landing Mitchell or a shut-down type of guy this year. I think Wilson was definitely interested in both Kaberle and Mitchell/Hammer but trying to swing both deals at the same time was too tough in the end. He didn’t know exactly what chips we had or what money was available when trying to trade for one player and sign another. In the end, we went cheap with Wallin, and I STILL feel like we are paying for it with his contract extension. Wallin gave us absolutely nothing in the playoffs.
Different roles, I want one of each for our D.
Getting one doesn’t replace the need for the other in my book.
"Douglas Murray is a humongous human being." – Drew Remenda
Agreed. But I rather have given up Clowe (maybe someone even lesser) and the 2nd rounder for Kaberle instead of Wallin. Kaberle could have made an impact last playoff run, and we would have a lot better understanding of our D situation now.
I don’t see how this applies to last year. Kaberle was never asked to waive his NTC during the season to my knowledge.
I don’t know if we would have gotten out of the first two rounds without Clowe. That line was incredible, sure Pav’s put the biscuit in the basket, but Clowe was the one digging it out of the corners for him.
"Douglas Murray is a humongous human being." – Drew Remenda
Kaberle was definitely available at the trade deadline last year though- but yes he would have had to waive his no trade clause. I think he would have to play on the Sharks. I also think a combination of the 2nd rounder and someone other than Clowe could have gotten us Kaberle.
My point is, I just think the Wallin trade was a poor one, and I would really have liked to see Kaberle and Mitchell in teal this coming year. The only way I see that happening is if we went are Kaberle last year at the trade deadline. Trying to swing both this summer was not very realistic.
I think Wilson decided to go conservative last year with Wallin, as opposed to going big with Campbell the year before. In the end, I really wish he went big.
Also, Campbell cost us a lot and got us nothing but the penalty that ended our playoff run. I can’t recall a deadline deal that has worked out for us yet, I wish he’d stop doing them all together.
"Douglas Murray is a humongous human being." – Drew Remenda
by Evilducks on Aug 23, 2010 9:19 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
I’m not saying the Campbell trade was good, I’m just noting a difference in philosophy when DW traded for Campbell (a marquee defenseman) and Wallin (a role player type).
We’ve traded for Marquee players many times at the deadline, it’s never worked out. We’ve traded for role players at the deadline, it’s never worked out.
STOP TRADING AT THE DEADLINE!
"Douglas Murray is a humongous human being." – Drew Remenda
I don’t think he is listening, because if things don’t turn around soon this summer, we are looking at another deadline trade this year.
This.
Seriously, for once, I want the team to be more or less set at the start of the season, and then the trade deadline used only to fill holes created by injury if necessary. I ranted on this above…
Z!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Tweet Tweet.
by ZeroIndulgence on Aug 23, 2010 10:29 AM PDT up reply actions
agreed
the last two years our biggest move were done in the offseason.. (i.e. Heatley and Boyle) and each year was pretty good, 09 playoffs aside. Its much better to have a team get the whole year to play together than one month if that…
by skilletboy on Aug 23, 2010 1:06 PM PDT up reply actions
Umm, Campbell performed pretty well
He was awesome down the stretch and played well vs. Dallas except for that penalty.
Yet we have nothing to show for it, except a bunch of picks and players gone. I don’t see how this worked for us.
"Douglas Murray is a humongous human being." – Drew Remenda
So trade acquisititions only work if they result in a stanley cup?
If that is the standard, then sure, they never work out.
But if you grade the contribution the player made to the team, then they often are good trades. If other players shit the bed (you know, those guys who have been on the team the whole year and have developed chemistry with each other by playing with each other all year) I don’t see how that can change the wisdom of doing the trade in the first place.
How about they only count as successful when the team actually improves some noticeable degree in the result? Last checked we bowed out of the playoffs in the 2nd round the 2 years previous to that one. How about if they aren’t the one watching from the penalty box as the team is sent home for the year?
If we’re not going to be improved as a team then I’d rather continue to develop young assets and keep our draft picks and hope we draft somebody that will stick around more than 2 months and nets us nothing more than we’ve already had.
"Douglas Murray is a humongous human being." – Drew Remenda
Well, in a year where we were the Stanley Cup favorites and our only weakness was considered to be the lack of a top puck moving defenseman, I’d rather have Brian Campbell for the 2 most important months of the year than Steve Bernier and whatever the value of a 26th round pick in the first round is. Which from 2000-2009 has been:
Brian Sutherby, Jason Bacashihua, Martin Vagner, Brian Boyle, Cory Schneider, Matt Pelech, Leland Irving, David Perron, Tyler Ennis, Kyle Palmieri.
Brian Campbell was a +4 with a goal and 3 assists in that series vs. Dallas, played 30 minutes a night, and was one of the only reasons that series even went 6 games besides Nabokov (that playoff choker…). He absolutely got us closer to a Stanley Cup in his 2 months here than a normal 26th overall pick ever will for a team.
You mean AHL rookie of the year Tyler Ennis?
Yeah, David Perron is pretty good too. Palmieri, he;s the duck prospect right?
That’s only a 2 out of 9 hit rate for guys picked in that slot who are better than replacement level players. Even then, Ennis looks good so far, no doubt, but has only played 10 NHL games. Perron looks ok, but has to improve to be considered a championship caliber top 6 winger. We will have to wait to see if Palmieri improves that lot.
Point is, the Sharks looked to be only a piece away from winning the Cup. Making that move at that time was exactly what a good GM should do. Campbell ended up being part of the solution during the Dallas series, as opposed to Thornton, Pavelski, Marleau, Seto, et al, guys who should have had an advantage over Campbell because they had played together all year and thus should have had chemistry.
I will cheer for Mitchell if we get him and hope for the best, my issue with him is injury not talent. Still, the quality of defenseman that will be available will be higher at the deadline than it currently is. Considering the playoffs are extremely likely for this team, and chemistry has yet to show itself in the playoffs for the players that have been given the opportunity to develop it, I fully support a plan to wait until midseason to acquire a top defenseman.
Thank god youre here, i dont know what i would do without your common sense here
by withintheruins14 on Aug 23, 2010 9:30 PM PDT up reply actions
if we don't get Mitchell
getting Kaberle would at least be an upgrade of some kind.
I’m with the people would would rather get a defensive defenseman, a shutdown guy, but we could also use an offensive d-man who can take up some of boyle’s minutes.
Proud member of the "Bring Back Semenov" Club
TOI
I think it’s clear from last season that both Dan Boyle and Douglas Murray need to play fewer minutes.
I would also say, based on the second half of the season, Vlasic needs to play more minutes.
That between ES and PK, Wallin has not played more than an average 20 minutes of ice time is very worrying to me.
The Kaberle vs. Mitchell debate is interesting in terms of whether we want a puck-mover or a shutdown man, but either one would likely give us 20+ minutes a night.
Nothing short of a career year from Wallin is going to do us any good assuming the blue-line will be as is from now until next July.
Considering we’ve taken, at best, a step sideways in goal as well, the team simply needs someone. Anyone. Bueller? I don’t want to give up any of our top 6 forwards, but without seeing how this years third line plays, I don’t know how else we’re going to make any improvement on last years’ roster. Because, on paper, this team is not as good as last season.
I know the ’Hawks might not be as good as they were last season, but are we any closer to beating them? The Kings and Coyotes still look pretty good. The Wings are still the Wings and the Canucks have one of the deeper blue-lines in the west.
I’m really not a fan anymore of having $21M invested in HTML. I feel like we should be building from the blue-line out. Our blue-line, as is, really only has 2 quality D-men and 4 role players.
Whatever. Can the season start already so I can stop my decent into Trade Joe Thornton madness?
They're not getting this kind of coverage at "Hockey Night In Canada" folks! - Randy Hahn
So if Wallin isn't top 4 material
Which I totally agree with. Does that mean the lines right now actually are…
Boyle – Murray
Vlasic – Huskins
Wallin – Demers
Leach
I’d be interested to see how good of a shutdown pairing Vlasic and Huskins would be
by SharksFanTillDeath on Aug 23, 2010 11:44 AM PDT reply actions
Given the need for some offense in the top 4
Isn’t the only real hope of success with the current lineup if we pair as follows:
Boyle – Murray
Vlasic – Demers
Huskins – Wallin
Leach
I realize its very scary to have Demers playing top 4 minutes, but I’d rather at least try a guy that might or might not be able to pull it off (Demers) than use a guy we all know can’t (Wallin).
As I said after Demers inked the contract extension: I hope that Demers can make a strong showing defensively this year and at least challenge for a top 4 role. I am probably being way too optimistic.
by jMoneyBrah on Aug 23, 2010 12:28 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
I actually kind of like this.
I can’t figure out why.
"Douglas Murray is a humongous human being." – Drew Remenda
I can agree with it to an extent...
I’d really like to see Demers get quality minutes over a longer stretch. I kinda feel the same way about Demers as many have stated feeling about Griess… It’s hard to judge what we have there.
by skilletboy on Aug 23, 2010 1:08 PM PDT up reply actions
Hows abouts:
Vlasic – Boyle
Murray – Demers
Huskins – Wallin
We’d have an awesome first pairing with some sick offensive potential and Demers would have a solid stay at home physical defensemen to give him some freedom in the offensive zone.
I have a ton of faith in Demers. He didn’t make any noticeable defensive mistakes when going up against the top teams in the league in the playoffs, and he’s only going to get better. I’d trust him in a number 4 spot with a guy like Murray or Vlasic backing him up.
I dunno i’ve just always wanted to see Boyle and Vlasic together for some reason. They both are our 2 best defensemen.
I know people talk about how that pairing would lack physicality but really Vlasic/Boyle is a ‘tougher’ pairing than Vlasic/Demers would be, and certainly tougher than Vlasic/Kaberle would’ve been. (a pairing many of us wanted)
I trust Vlassic to keep an eye on Demers more than Murray.
"Douglas Murray is a humongous human being." – Drew Remenda
But who do you trust more to log big minutes while going up against top competition, Murray or Vlasic? Also, who do you think Boyle could play off of better in the offensive zone, Murray or Vlasic?
I think Murray would make a fine watchdog for Demers.
I think Vlassic would do better with either one. The question is who needs it more?
"Douglas Murray is a humongous human being." – Drew Remenda
Plus Murray’s lack of speed can’t make up for Demer’s mistakes as well as Vlassic could…
by skilletboy on Aug 23, 2010 2:20 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
His stay-at-home-ness could though lol.
Demers can’t keep making mistakes like he did during the regular season last year. He SHOULD be past that now.
What makes you think he should be past that now? What’s changed between the last game he played, and now?
Z!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Tweet Tweet.
by ZeroIndulgence on Aug 23, 2010 2:26 PM PDT up reply actions
Because he looked good in the last few games he played? He looked great in the playoffs imo. He didn’t look nervous and he wasn’t making stupid mistakes like he did in the regular season, even though he was playing against top competition.
He was also playing as a pp specialist and getting like 4 minutes a night. And now you think he can handle 20 without being a huge liability?
Z!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Tweet Tweet.
by ZeroIndulgence on Aug 23, 2010 2:30 PM PDT up reply actions
I’d trust Vlasic-Wallin much more, just because we know what we’re going to get out of them. There will be no surprises. Make Demers play his way into a top 4 role…make him force the coaching staff’s hand with his play.
Sigh, we really need another D man…
Z!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Tweet Tweet.
by ZeroIndulgence on Aug 23, 2010 2:33 PM PDT up reply actions
Obviously Wallin is more proven as a defensemen then Demers is, that goes without saying. During the regular season Demers was making huge mistakes nearly everytime he played against the Blackhawks or any other top team that pressured anyone with the puck. He played 9 games against 2 of the teams that gave him a ton of trouble and didn’t make any mistakes, limited minutes or not that seems like a huge improvement to me.
He’s only going to get better, and if we want our blueline to not suck we’re going to need to make him work in our top 4 imo, and i think he will.
Nah...
I’d prefer the original one posted by Plank. Wallin isn’t a top 4 guy…but he’s the closest out of him, Huskins, and Demers. And Vlasic-Wallin probably won’t get scored on too much, even though it’d be a black hole offensively. Murray knows how to work with Boyle, and Huskins-Demers looked decent at the end of last year playing together, and could definately get sheltered minutes.
Ultimately, I just really don’t trust Demers more than a power play specialist at this point. But he needs minutes to work on his defensive game, which he can get on the bottom pairing.
Z!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Tweet Tweet.
by ZeroIndulgence on Aug 23, 2010 2:29 PM PDT up reply actions
Obviously if we were going into the playoffs tomorrow i would not advocate putting Demers in the top 4, but Demers has 82 games to get the hang of it and i think he will.
I feel like it’s almost a waste time playing Vlasic-Wallin together the whole regular season when we know it’s (as you said) ‘an offensive black hole’ that isn’t going to be very effective in the playoffs. If Demers doesn’t work out in the top 4 then we know what we have with him (at least for that season) and we can look to add someone at the deadline.
I don’t want to go into the playoffs with Vlasic/Wallin as our 2nd pairing; but i also don’t want to go into the playoffs with Vlasic/Demers if we don’t know for sure that Demers can handle being in our top 4. What better way to definitively find out whether he can handle a top 4 role then to play him as one during the regular season?
I vaguely remember when Vlassic had some form of offense to contribute. Maybe he’ll have more without Blake there to launch rockets from the point?
"Douglas Murray is a humongous human being." – Drew Remenda
Yeah I still think he can contribute offensively, but i dunno if he’s ready to do it solo. I kinda feel like he could work really well with Boyle or Demers to create a ‘double threat’ sort of scenario. Having another defensemen who can shoot the puck shouldn’t keep him from shooting, but i guess it does seem to do that with him; maybe he does need to be with a guy like Wallin to bring out his offensive skills.
think about it this way, vlasic and boyle can provide good offense from the backend, and then murray he likes to hit the puck hard into the boards and demers can come scoop it up and make plays
by withintheruins14 on Aug 23, 2010 9:33 PM PDT up reply actions
HAHAHA!!
Willie Watch.
You can get arrested for that!
by Morti on Aug 23, 2010 12:32 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
so we couldnt get aaron asham for $755,000? what is going on around here
by withintheruins14 on Aug 23, 2010 1:32 PM PDT reply actions
I’m starting to wonder if they might be considering giving Nolan a tryout invite to camp to see if he can still play.
He’s been hanging out a lot at Captain’s skates and I think he would be willing to go through a tryout contract for a chance to finish his career in SJ…
Either way I thought Asham would be a target too. It makes me think they have something in mind.
by skilletboy on Aug 23, 2010 2:23 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
He’s at captain’s ice every year. Still, it would be fun to see Buster in teal.
"Douglas Murray is a humongous human being." – Drew Remenda
Yes I realize he does every year...
But with no team to go and practice with, as with as not having a contract, it makes sense he might be willing to tryout with SJ.
Plus I’m hearing more Internet chatter about Nolan stating he still think he can play hard and is willing to prove it.
I trust DW not to sign him just as PR though. If he gets a shot I think they’ll be sure he can still bring it.
by skilletboy on Aug 23, 2010 5:29 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
sign him
please
how is he not an upgrade
by withintheruins14 on Aug 23, 2010 9:34 PM PDT up reply actions
The thing is it’s a teams market right now. There isn’t any reason to hurry. Personally I’d like to know he can still play at a high level. We are up against the cap and over 35 contracts stay on the books no matter what.
by skilletboy on Aug 23, 2010 10:25 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
umm...
when did we get to up against the cap? Last i checked we still had a few mill to the cap…
by animadiversion on Aug 24, 2010 1:12 AM PDT up reply actions
Given the fact that we have seven D under contract and are currently trying to get another… While being only a couple million from the cap…. that’s up against the cap…?!
Especially if we still need to sign or promote forwards…
We can’t just throw away 500k or + if Nolan isn’t able to play.
by skilletboy on Aug 24, 2010 9:52 AM PDT via mobile up reply actions
I take it
youre counting Leach as one of our D but he has a two way contract, and a few million is quite a lot of a cushion when you only have 1 D man to add and a bottom 6 forward. Only one of those requires decent amount of money.
by animadiversion on Aug 24, 2010 10:01 AM PDT up reply actions
Rumor is that Willie Mitchell is supposed to decide by 7 PM pacific time today, or tomorrow at the very latest.
It doesn’t seem like a good sign that he’s about to decide the same day he was practicing with the Canucks.
Although it’s pretty awesome that Willie Mitchell apparently broke the glass with a shot:
A rumor from NHLSourcesSay, who last week said he’d make up his mind by Friday, and tomorrow will tell us that for sure it will be by Wednesday…see where I’m going?
I haven’t heard one single, substantial rumor of when he will make up his mind from anyone of note. Until then, I don’t expect anything.
Z!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Tweet Tweet.
by ZeroIndulgence on Aug 23, 2010 2:25 PM PDT up reply actions
Is NHLSourcesSay supposed to be bleacher report, or is that just what hockey people call unsubstantiated rumors?
A bleacher report article said, “Mitchell will make his decision today. I expect him to go to the San Jose Sharks as it keeps him in the Western Conference, where the Sharks are the team with probably the best chance to represent the West in the finals.” Which obviously means nothing, but makes me happy inside lol.
The rumors of a Willie Mitchell signing being imminent are coming from tweets from people (media people i’m assuming) who were at Canucks ice today where he was practicing.
Khaaz…here is the actual interview with Willie himself
While he is wearing a generic jersey, ndn takes care to respect the process of what he is going through…
It is interesting to a Canuck fan like me that the interview went right up on the Canucks site. He was a Canuck, but is a UFA right now. Shows how well he is thought of…at least.
I can’t watch it at work but i read a recap. It’s kind of worrying as a Shark fan that he says the term is not important since that means he could sign a super low cap hit contract + bonuses, which would make it a lot easier for the Canucks to add him.
Here’s a good post from a guy in this Willie Mitchell thread i’ve been reading.
What I really would have liked to know is whether Mitchell wants a big role with any team he signs with, or if he is willing to be a bit more of a roleplayer.
I think that would be more telling than what kind of term he wants, etc. It’s the one thing Vancouver doesn’t really have to offer compared to LA, SJ and Washington.
I totally agree with him. One of these media people should’ve asked the question about what role he wants to play on whichever team he signs with, does he want to play a top pairing role again or does he want to take it easy in a 2nd or 3rd pairing?
Obviously if he said he said he was ready for a top pairing role it would likely mean he signs with the Sharks or the Caps, if he said he wouldn’t mind playing in a lower pairing it probably would mean he’s gonna sign with the Canucks.
Well Khaaz, that might be a great point on the other teams, but probably less so in Canuckland. Willis is smart enough to know that any team he signs with is going to be deep. ( not to say it is not a factor, just that it is probably a lot farther down the Pro/Con list he wrote for the Canucks than the other 3 teams )
Teams usually don’t promise those things before camp anyhow. For instance, you are a young defenseman looking to break in ( lets say you were a last cut last year, and have improved )
Now the team brings in some old guy to knock you down the list? Not a good message for the young players. I know here, I am excited to see camp more than usual because there are so many young guys fighting for spots.
I think ED and I had this discussion on an earlier thread. Like I said then, I think Willie would be just fine staying home and being a 3rd pair with top PK minutes.
He knows that injuries usually throw those plans out the window anyhow! Plus, except for the two new guys, he has played in all positions (Pairing 1,2, and 3 ) and with all the other guys anyhow.
You might even say that familiarity is a point in the Canucks’ favour.
Well i just think it would be telling since on the Sharks he would certainly be on one of our top 2 pairings, likely our top pairing with Boyle.
If he is ok with being on the 3rd pairing then that might be another point in the Canucks’ favor, unfortunately.
The thing is he’s a really competitive guy, I don’t know that he’s all for playing 3rd pairing minutes. I wouldn’t be. It’s not like he played poorly… ever. Takes a hit on the noggin and the Canucks give his job to the first UFA they could get their hands on. I don’t see any real faith in the club in him, but maybe I’m not seeing something.
"Douglas Murray is a humongous human being." – Drew Remenda
No one “gave his job to the first UFA…”.
The Canucks saw when they were down to their last 4 NHL Dee in Game 6 last year that they needed to get depth.
They always talked about his health being first. It was not until after the deals were made that he started skating hard and took the tests. Before that, he was an unknown quantity.
They know he is the defensive defenseman they love when he is healthy. As soon as it was determined he was willing to get in the game again, they were right there…talking to him and trying to move the money.
Its more a Cap thing ED. If they knew he was good to go earlier, I don’t think they would have planned around him.
Now that they know, they are working to try and get him in. He may sign for another team for more money or term ( though he says above term is not the big thing )…but he knows how much he is loved here.
By both fans and the team.
Depth via UFA’s is a cute idea, but doesn’t really pan out in the cap world. Signing UFA’s eats all of your cap space and leaves you with big holes elsewhere. They signed 2 new defensemen, and barring an unforseen injury to Salo were looking to move at least Bieksa out. Mitchell was unforseen and it doesn’t look like he was expected to return, so I don’t see how they added more depth.
"Douglas Murray is a humongous human being." – Drew Remenda
Damn ED…I enjoy our convos, but sometimes…! LOL
The timeline I mentioned above is key.
At the time they signed both Ballard and Hammer, Willie was still an unknown. He had not worked out for anyone, or did any base line tests.
Somewhere in July, he showed the Canucks and the rest of the NHL he was healthy.
The Canucks had already made two big signings for the back end, but as soon as the word got out that Willie wanted to, AND COULD play again, they were in.
Yes, they have to make moves. ( Salo being injured was before Willie came out as being healthy, I think…could be wrong there )
They were going to move Bieksa ( even though they could keep him ) anyhow, because he makes 3.75 and would be a 5-6 defenseman. His skills are better used as a Top 4 somewhere else, and the Canucks can get back an experienced forward )
Mitchell, however, is a Top defensive defenseman. Every team can use and wants that. As soon as late July, when he first said he was good to go, the Canucks were there.
He is very well thought of here, and was hardly “unforseen”. He was a question that had to be answered. He was not replaced by Ballard or Hammer. They are to improve a defense that was too injured last year in the playoffs.
Depth via UFA? You mean like Hammer? Yes. And yes, Willie is a UFA. But this is his team, his home, and where he wanted to be.
That may change because of the Cap. But I am pretty sure if the Canucks knew earlier that he was healthy again, he would have been a guy they talked to sooner than they did.
As for adding more depth, maybe you don’t see it, but the rest of the NHL and its media did. Its probably one of the main reasons THN picked the Canucks for the Cup this year!
They added Hammer and Ballard, and are losing Bieksa and possibly/probably Mitchell. I don’t see how depth is improved.
Also, they say that about Vancouver (and San Jose) every year. /shrug.
"Douglas Murray is a humongous human being." – Drew Remenda
After watching the video, Mitchell seems really excited to play again and he really wants to be a large part of a team that has a chance at the cup; “large part” to me means he wants to be a top pairing guys again, which tells me he’s leaning towards the Sharks, or maybe the Caps.
Or maybe i’m just telling myself that lol.
That actually what i thought when i watched the video. I think winning the cup is a big deal to him and since he has such high profile teams after him i think its more likely he’ll go with one of the two biggest and thats the Sharks and Caps
Yes, but I’d rather go on a cup run with another team than no run at all… ;)
please to be exiting my eyebrow parade, son. You appear to be raining on it. - CTGray
WHY HAS THERE NOT BEEN A BIG WILLIE STYLE PHOTOSHOP OF THIS YET?
GET IT DONE!!!
They're not getting this kind of coverage at "Hockey Night In Canada" folks! - Randy Hahn
Secretly glad I don't sit behind the glass...
please to be exiting my eyebrow parade, son. You appear to be raining on it. - CTGray
Man
the lack of hockey and lack of news on Mitchell seems to be making a lot of us kind of bitter. Just reading through this thread some people seem rather testy…
Proud member of the "Bring Back Semenov" Club
I’m always bitter and testy… It’s a byproduct of reading and commenting on WTC far too much.
Also, it’s a lack of hockey more than lack of news, for me anyway.
"Douglas Murray is a humongous human being." – Drew Remenda
Just wait for the first losing streak
Then there will be hockey, and we’ll STILL be bitter and testy
They're not getting this kind of coverage at "Hockey Night In Canada" folks! - Randy Hahn
Shut up, asshole!
:-P
Z!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Tweet Tweet.
by ZeroIndulgence on Aug 23, 2010 6:30 PM PDT up reply actions
flagged
"Sorry guys, I’m not going to try and hit (Douglas) Murray anymore. It doesn’t work." - Steve Ott, Dallas Stars.
by SwisherThresher on Aug 23, 2010 7:19 PM PDT up reply actions
How dare you.
Don't let the name deceive you, I'm not just a Sharks fan but a Lakers, 49ers, Angels, Giants (and to a lesser extent) Capitals, and Titans fan.
by SharksFanEst.1994 on Aug 23, 2010 8:05 PM PDT up reply actions
This offseason is going on forever….
Wallin is a fine defensemen. Doesn’t change the fact that he is overpaid.
Churning and burning, they yearn for the cup.
Twitter! rmorse05
Look, how could anyone not want this roster
Marleau-Thornton-Heatley
Clowe-Pavelski-Setogucho
Mcginn-Couture-Nolan
Mitchell-Nichol-Meyers
Vlasic-Murray
Murray-Mitchell
Huskins-Wallin
Leach, Demers
Nittymaki
Greiss, Stalock
I would feel very confident of our team making a deep playoff run like this
Demers can go in wherever we want him and shuffle the roster around
by withintheruins14 on Aug 23, 2010 9:44 PM PDT reply actions
oh geez two typos
how could i do that to boyle
by withintheruins14 on Aug 23, 2010 9:46 PM PDT up reply actions
Douglas Murray is an enormous human being
But he’s still no Dan F***ing Boyle.
They're not getting this kind of coverage at "Hockey Night In Canada" folks! - Randy Hahn
why are there two murrays?
please to be exiting my eyebrow parade, son. You appear to be raining on it. - CTGray
Definitely, i’ll be damn confident in our team if it ends up like that and Willie Mitchell is at least half as good as he used to be. Hopefully we can get Nolan for a mill or somethin, that would be amazing.
Pleeeease let this be our actual roster next season, except add Boyle and take out a Murray clone.
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recent FanPosts
In Association With
Latest Puck Daddy - NHL from Yahoo! Sports
- Friday’s Three Stars: Brassard wins it for Blue Jackets in overtime; Halak blanks Kings
- Puck Previews: Blues host Kings in first game after break; Blackhawks’ road struggles
- Best barometer of the St. Louis Blues’ success? Gifts from political lobbyists
- ‘Scott Gomez Can’t Put Anything In’: The ‘Hey Jude’ of Scott Gomez protest songs (Video)
- Puck Headlines: Jimmy Howard’s injury; top 50 players; drinking beer out of hockey skate (yuck)
Latest stories and headlines from NHL.com
- WHL Roundup: A look at Friday's games
- Gabriel and Leipsic two goals each as the Winterhawks defeat the Silvertips 7-3
- Feser solidifies Americans win with two empty-net goals against the Thunderbirds
- Holberg scores winner in shootout as the Chiefs beat the Royals 6-5
- Brown makes 26 saves to lead the Rockets over the Cougars 2-1
Certain photos copyright © 2012 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
