Fear the Fin Debates: How should we feel about Dany Heatley?
by FTF Staff on Oct 12, 2011 2:00 AM PDT
in Special Features
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PrintAlthough Dany Heatley's break-up with San Jose was not as controversial as his split from Ottawa (in fact, the Sharks kind of pulled the "it's not you, it's me, but it's also kinda you" card), Heatley's tenure with the Sharks didn't end on the best of terms. His playoff performance was a complete disappointment, his season scoring was extremely down from his first year with the team and his health and conditioning were called into serious question.
Now, three games into Minnesota's season, Dany Heatley has a goal and two assists (on a pair of Setoguchi goals no less) in a solid start for his new team. He looks healthier, committed, and more like the player who had 39 goals with the Sharks in 2009-2010 than the one who had 26 in 2010-2011.
For some, this has ruffled feathers. Others are simply happy to see him do well. Plank and Matt spent some time this week discussing both sides. Considering that Heatley's Wild just played Ottawa last night, it's as good a time as any for a debate. Enjoy.
Matt: While I'm happy to see Heatley thrive in Minnesota, I can't help but resent him a bit for how he played his final year in San Jose. He started his tenure with the Sharks with such promise, I was so excited to see how he and Thornton would mesh together. Really, he had a fantastic first year with the team and I was happy the trade was made.
In his second year, though, I really felt as if he gave up. He came into camp out of shape, a result of his nagging injury, and played the whole year in a slower, less committed fashion. I thought it was the result of an injury that would never heal, but according to observers of the Wild, Heatley is skating well and backchecking and being the player we expected him to be. For some reason, that just irks me.
Jason: Dany Heatley is a polarizing figure. The Galactic Empire and the Rebel Alliance could have both used him on recruitment posters and seen an unprecedented rise in enrollment. All of Ottawa's fanbase and now a fair amount of San Jose's holds a grudge against him for various reasons, and I find it very unfortunate. In Ottawa, it is because he asked to be traded and those private conversations magically got leaked to the public. In San Jose, it is because he loved it here and didn't meet the expectations that the front office had for a player they were going to be paying 19 million dollars over the next three years.
Essentially, the Sharks moved a guy who underperformed in exchange for a really good player in Martin Havlat as well as salary and cap space. These things allowed them to offer extensions to Brent Burns and Logan Couture. I know you understand this Matt, but I wanted to bring it up because San Jose was the one dictating the terms here-- Heatley had no idea the trade was coming. From a big picture standpoint, the Sharks became a stronger organization after the deal as well, even if they end up losing on the Heatley/Havlat direct comparision.
So Heatley realizes he went from a perennial Stanley Cup contender to a team that is trying to rebuild. So he is trying his damnedest to get back to elite status with people from all over pissing on him. So he approaches this as an opportunity to prove people wrong and sees it as a second chance. So he works on his skating in the offseason and tries to fix the biggest hole in his game.
So what? Good for him.
Matt: I'm all for the Sharks making the swap, as we've discussed before and agree on, Heatley may never have become the same guy he was his first year in any other year with San Jose and Havlat brings some speed and chips in goals. The added cash saving helps a ton too, as you mentioned. If Heatley being traded is what it took for him to get his head on straight, so be it.
The problem I have with the guy is that he's had so many chances and potential eye-opening experiences that this lesson should have sunk in with him earlier in his career. Minnesota is his fourth team, and it took him this long to get the picture? He had the chance of a lifetime to win with San Jose, and he squandered it? He may not have known the trade was coming, but he definitely didn't make very many friends with his conditioning and perceived level of effort with the team.
For some reason, I just have a hard time rooting for a guy that effectively bailed on two teams. If he has a good year in Minnesota, I'm not going to fret it one bit from the standpoint of a San Jose fan, and it's always nice to see a guy succeed. For me, though, it's really hard to consider myself a Heatley fan at this point in time. Maybe eventually he works his way back into a player I'm comfortable rooting for, but he's not there right now.
If we're going with Star Wars references, Heatley is like Anakin Skywalker. Stuck with him a bit, forgave some earlier missteps, but this last flameout (Get it? Mustafar joke.) has just soured me on him in general.
Now, if Heatley decides to sacrifice himself and comes in to throw Chuck Fletcher into a core shaft right before he finally gets the better of Doug Wilson in a trade, I'll rethink my stance.
Jason: There's a huge difference between ambivalence and actively rooting against a player though, which is what the crux of my argument is-- ambivalence is fine (you could say I'm ambivalent towards ambivalence), but hoping he does poorly in Minnesota seems petty. And I think that's where my opinions begin to clash with others (not necessarily you), because I don't harbor any resentment towards him for his career in San Jose. Partly because I never saw an issue with his "intangibles", partly because I thought he was still a successful player despite his on-ice shortcomings, and mostly because all of our interactions with him were positive and never indicated that he was a guy who was the big issue he's always made out to be.
As for Heatley "taking four teams to get the picture" or being a guy "who effectively bailed on two teams" I think that's a good thing to tackle because it's brought up so often. I don't think those situations are related. You have an unfortunate car crash that led to the death of a teammate, a situation that was forgiven by Dan Snyder's family. Morality is a tricky subject to cover, especially for those outside of the situation, but ultimately the lesson is that people make mistakes-- if Snyder's family can forgive, I think the public should forgive as well.
Then you have the situation where Heatley requests a trade in private, only to have those conversations become public. That was a PR nightmare for Heatley, but it's pretty clear who leaked the information to the media. And then you have a season where Heatley plays with an injury for nearly the entire year and is out of shape either because or due to it. I don't see an overarching theme between the three. If anything, he's just displaying the traits of your normal everyday run of the mill human being. The difference is that he gets paid a lot of money to perform his profession.
I always feel like I'm playing Devil's Advocate when it comes to Heatley, just because he's so vilified by so many throughout the League. I think the main thing that brings on the hate is the dollar amount of his contract. That's always been a funny thing to me, but for the sake of brevity, I'll pose a question to you on the matter-- do you think you would still feel the Dark Side rising within you when you hear Heatley's name if he made less galactic credits?
Search your feelings, Taylor. You know it to be true.
Matt: Your mind powers will not work on me, boy. You're trying to paint me in to a corner here, labeling me as someone who wishes that Heatley would do poorly just because I can't bring myself to root for the guy. I don't resent him at all for his time in San Jose, but last season just made me feel "meh" towards him as a player. I'm in that ambivalent group of ambivalent people you're ambivalent about, you could say. He will do what he does in Minnesota without any hate or support from me. (I know he cares, oh so much)
Where I disagree with your stance is that I don't see any reason to outwardly root FOR him. I'm not advocating that we root against him, but I don't get why a San Jose fan should feel any real loyalty to a guy who didn't take full advantage of the situation he was presented when he was acquired by Doug Wilson and a team who had a real shot at a Stanley Cup. Playoff numbers are hard to judge a guy on. I'm taking issues with the fitness and commitment levels.
Also, I'm not trying to judge Heatley for past mistakes. The car crash is a tragedy that neither of us even brought up while he was here for the reasons you mentioned. The trade request issues, and subsequent veto of the trade that would have sent him to Edmonton... that one gets to me a bit but not enough for me to go on a Jedi witch-hunt.
The imperial credits he's paid has a lot to do with it, I agree with you on that. He makes so much money that there is really no excuse for him to be out of shape. That's a hard stance to have, and it takes the human element out of it, sure. But for some reason, I just can't defend a guy who gets paid so much and needs additional motivation to get his rear in gear. He's made his mistakes and he's trying to get better... I just don't see why he couldn't do it in San Jose.
My high expectations are my weakness, and your faith in Heatley is yours.
Jason: Clarifications are needed here so I will sum them up-- I think rooting against Heatley to fail in Minnesota is petty, but I'm not advocating someone should root for him just because he was a member of the Sharks organization. That's stupider than Jar Jar Binks. And Jar Jar Binks is stupider than George Lucas without a beard.
Your second paragraph is interesting because I feel it captures the anti-Heatley sentiment quite well. What you're saying is that Heatley burned up the majority of his goodwill with his lack of conditioning last season, leading many to become ambivalent towards his success with another team. So when said player does take an active interest in improving his conditioning and skating ability, it now "irks you" (first paragraph). Maybe I'm missing something here, but that seems like a situation where a player tries to right his wrongs and invites ill-will because he is trying to improve his game. Whether or not he did it in San Jose almost becomes secondary-- it's because he didn't do it here but is now doing it somewhere else that is an issue. I feel like we both did a lot of Dany Heatley defending last season and now you're dancing around like a Twi'lek. You look great though.
As for monetary compensation playing a role in his criticisms, I understand how that can be a sticking point. For me that's more of on the business side of transactions-- when analyzing how a player is performing on the ice, salary kind of goes out the window for me. Take Niclas Wallin for example. The offseason was when his contract was criticized (and boy did we ever criticize it), but once the season starts it seems logical to let that go and focus on how he's performing in the role assigned to him, and if anything, focus on management for making the decision rather than the player getting the best deal he can. I understand that with money comes expectations, but it's easy to forget Heatley scored 39 goals with the team in his first season and was fourth on the team in points last year. Maybe it wasn't the success that was expected, but it was still success nonetheless.
Alright, let's send this conversation the way of Alderaan. Final thoughts-- you may fire when ready.
Matt: I get your points and I understand where you are coming from. The comeback story is always one that grabs people. It's why redemption movies are so popular. If Heatley comes back and leads his team to the Cup, I'll follow it on the edge of my seat and admit you were right. Tell your sister, you were right.
The poor last season, the trade drama, the contract implications all just roll into a ball of something I just can't get behind right now. I feel bad, he was always nice to us in our interactions with him and even made a stellar "Dumb and Dumber" reference in a post-game interview. I just can't do it.
Concentrate fire on that conclusion.
Jason: Heatley may fail in Minnesota, he may succeed. He may score 40 goals, he may score 20. The Wild may struggle to make the playoffs, or...well, they're going to struggle to make the playoffs. But no matter what, I wish him the best because I feel like he's got the short end of the stick in the media, got heaped with the majority of the blame for the Sharks inability to make the Stanley Cup Finals, and is a guy who deserves to be acknowledged for his approach to his offseason training regiment.
Even if it didn't happen in San Jose.
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I have no ill will toward him from his postseason play at all.
He seemed to genuinely like playing here and while here he gave us a few great memories. Like it was said above, it’s not as if he forced his way out, it was a management decision. So light it up for the Wild Dany, just don’t do it against the Sharks please.
agreed. Finding out he had a broken hand a good chunk of the second half and all through the playoffs and he gutted through and wanted to contribute anyway he could, plus taking a cue for Big Joe and commiting more to backchecking and playing a 200 foot game (although that was limited due to injury) made me actually like him more as a player. I was also a big fan of what Wellwood brought to the team, but losing heatley and seto for a d man like burns, speed and consistent performer (when healthy) like havlet and bringing in more size, strength on the depth lines makes me fine with all the moves. I’ll miss seto and heatley but love the opportunities it has created for other guys at the same time. Like giving Thornton and Patty a right handed shot like Pavelski who can not only fill that role, but has proven he can give big time and consistent play in any role we put him in automatically makes me ok with losing seto. getting the speed from havlet and proven playoff performing made me ok with the heatley trade although i’ll miss the guy.
by dannyschmanny on Oct 12, 2011 3:15 PM PDT up reply actions
Just wanted to let the FTF Staff know that the sidebar is showing up underneath the main content on the front page
I am pretty sure that it is being caused by this article:
http://www.fearthefin.com/2011/10/8/2478466/sharks-destroy-outmanned-coyotes-win-6-3
I left a comment with what I think the issue is on that article.
GO SHARKS!
by jMoneyBrah on Oct 12, 2011 2:10 AM PDT reply actions 2 recs
My Boy
It is nearly 3 AM, this wont get fixed till the fear the fin ship sails in the morning. In the meantime, why don’t we indulge in a late dinner?
"Skillet, we just spent $64,000 in that bar. So we're gonna have to get jobs to cover up the fact that we rob banks" -Mouse Fitzgerald
Though
Nice job catching the open tags on the last recap.
"Skillet, we just spent $64,000 in that bar. So we're gonna have to get jobs to cover up the fact that we rob banks" -Mouse Fitzgerald
UGH
Could never have the chops for that. ABSOLUTE PERECTION required AT ALL TIMES.
"Skillet, we just spent $64,000 in that bar. So we're gonna have to get jobs to cover up the fact that we rob banks" -Mouse Fitzgerald
Perfection even, and I am talking about html. PAGES and PAGES of code and one misplaced > FUCKS EVERYTHING
"Skillet, we just spent $64,000 in that bar. So we're gonna have to get jobs to cover up the fact that we rob banks" -Mouse Fitzgerald
Yeah.
The nice thing with the web is that you can fix any issues quickly. As someone who has done print design… fuck… that is where you need PERFECTION.
See what happens when you misspell a headline on pamphlet that gets printed 50,000 times. It ain’t fun for your or your wallet.
GO SHARKS!
lol
you said erection
(I’ve been spending too much time on BoC)
Proud member of the "Bring Back Semenov" Club
"The only crying allowed in hockey is when you lose a playoff series, retire or JR is speaking publicly." - Jamie Baker
"You are down with the homies, my friend." - Randy Hahn
Kent Huskins cares.
"Don't fart on my chair mutha fuckah!" - Randy Hahn
"Pavs with great feed but what a release by Wingels Peanut Butter Baby!"" - Jamie Baker
I have had similar issues in the past – it used to be so frustrating trying to figure out where the missed tag was – especially on long pages like the FTF front page. Nowadays we have FireBug and the Chrome console – these young whippersnappers have it so easy. I used to have to try to find the orphan HTML tags in the snow… for seven miles… uphill… with no shoes.
GO SHARKS!
Yeah, last time I worked with HTML
was 2003. I take it things have changed a bit.
"Skillet, we just spent $64,000 in that bar. So we're gonna have to get jobs to cover up the fact that we rob banks" -Mouse Fitzgerald
Hey brah
You’re so money. Sooooo money. That was precisely the issue.
Fixed, and thanks!
"Now get on board going down the river float, we gonna raise a ruckus tonight" - OCMS
Fear The Fin: Where Selling Your Soul Is The Likely Solution
by Mr. Plank on Oct 12, 2011 9:36 AM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
Hmmm
The ambivalence is strong in these two.
"Skillet, we just spent $64,000 in that bar. So we're gonna have to get jobs to cover up the fact that we rob banks" -Mouse Fitzgerald
I personally would like to see Heater and Seto succeed with the Wild.
For all of Heatley’s perceived shortcomings last year, I still remember him skating with a torn groin in the playoffs two years ago. You could see that he was in significant pain, but he showed up for every shift. That, to me, showed that he played with heart and guts.
And I thought it was widely accepted that his skating at the beginning of last season was suffering from the injury suffered in the afore mentioned playoffs. Not to make excuses for the guy, but it never seemed that he was ever back to 100%, and just had a down year – it happens (Marleau’s -19 48pt 2007-08 season comes to mind).
During his time with the Sharks he seemed, at least outwardly, nothing but a good teammate and also stepped up his defensive game when that was asked of him. Plus with all the hate thrown at him by the media/fans in Ottawa and Canada for what seem to have been personal issues makes me feel for the guy.
Much like it took Mitchell a few seasons to shake off his leg injury, I suspect that this offseason was the first Heatley was healthy and able to fully train in preparation for regular season hockey. Throw on top of that the trade, and I am sure you have an extra determined player – who is being installed into an offense with: another highly talented player he is familiar with (Seto), another All-Star playmaking center, and the expectation to be the catalyst for the top line and entire offense. All of this leads me to expect him to be very productive with the Wild.
That we got a speedy, playmaking winger in Havlat – and the cap-space to extend Couture and Burns – makes a tremendous amount of sense at the organizational level. I wouldn’t go so far as to say that one of Burns or Couture would not be with us after this season if we didn’t do this trade, but this trade did allow us to extend both players and have room to add depth in other areas.
This trade cannot be fully evaluated until Havlat plays, and plays in the playoffs. Until then it will be fun to watch the Wild our of the corner of my eye, and root for both Seto and Heatley.
GO SHARKS!
I’m really glad you mention Marleau. Why are we so quick to forgive and not resent Patty for his 48 point season and him dissapearing each year (aka most of the Detroit series)? Is it because he is a career long Shark or because Dany is easily villafied?
Waiting for the Cup to come to SJ since 1991...
GO SHARKS!
Find me on Twitter @njahoda
He's totally resented.
It’s just with Marleau we have a freakishly short memory. Whenever he has cold spell, people are lining up to lead crusades, but the moment he breaks out, people forget they even planned the crusades. It’s very silly.
However, I think Marleau deserves forgiveness for those cold spells because he consistently (in recent years) comes out near a point per game. So if he’s a streaky player… got to take the bitter with the better, really.
I agree with both arguments. Which makes me the Ambivalent Queen of Ambivalencia
Heatley was not the “locker room” cancer we were warned he would be when we traded for him, but he also didn’t score the 50 goals a season we dreamed of either. Thus, I am surprised when SJ people hate Heatley, but I’m not surprised when people feel meh about him.
I don’t resent Heatley at all, but I know that every time I see him do something awesome for the Wild a little voice in the back of my head will cry “Why couldn’t you do that for us?” However, wishing for him to fail just to assuage that feeling is just petty.
I do love watching him and Seto together though, even if they are in the wrong uniform. When the Wild come play the Sharks at HP Pavillion I hope people give a nice appreciative homecoming to those two (who always seemed to like San Jose).
Anyway, major kudos for all the awesome Star Wars references.
I'm
whatever. If he does well that’s good but if he doesn’t oh well. He wasn’t with the team long enough for me to say I’ll miss him. Also didn’t really do anything to where I wanted the team to keep him. He just didn’t fit within the team to excel I think and for the money that he’s getting, anything short of great isn’t worth it. Yeah, he could’ve gotten another year to prove himself since Marleau has gotten so many but with his age and already given 2 years, I think it would have been too much of a risk not to make the move. If not for the cap space then for the lack of speed. If anything, I wish Heatley does well so that Seto can do even better.
I wrote a couple comments and then accidentally wrote them in the OT thread...
So, how about I just ask: Heatley = Selanne 2.0?
And also, let me just say this kind of article is exactly why I stick around FTF. Love it, fellas.
Flugenweb. Spacecode. Twitzone. Assmode.
"The last time I made a video in a hotel room…..very different than this." – Drew Remenda
2010-2011 FTF 2 Fantasy Hockey CHAMPION
That and the gripping late night conversation! Though jwizzle is mr big time college radio dj, he don’t sleep till the sun sets AM I RIGHT
"Skillet, we just spent $64,000 in that bar. So we're gonna have to get jobs to cover up the fact that we rob banks" -Mouse Fitzgerald
Oh, man I used to DJ in undergrad. I had the 1:30-3:30 AM shift and pretty much was a walking zombie, but I loved it.
by WhatsAMataHari on Oct 12, 2011 2:52 AM PDT up reply actions
Actually, I took over the sports department and don't have my radio show anymore.
Now my crazy late night hours are only because of my bad habits.
Flugenweb. Spacecode. Twitzone. Assmode.
"The last time I made a video in a hotel room…..very different than this." – Drew Remenda
2010-2011 FTF 2 Fantasy Hockey CHAMPION
Similar situation
But I feel like Heatley was more productive while he was with the Sharks. Plus he never missed a open net in game seven of a 2002 series against Colorado. That and the Ducks. Fuck the Ducks.
GO SHARKS!
With Selanne, I felt way more betrayed
because of the way he went back to the Ducks and has been there ever since. It is probably totally silly but I feel like (in retrospect) his loyalty was always to the Ducks.
by WhatsAMataHari on Oct 12, 2011 3:10 AM PDT up reply actions
I’m more pissed at Selanne, even now, because subsequent years showed he clearly had it in him to be an elite goal scorer. He just sucked, hard, when he was here. It wasn’t Sutter’s system, or his lack of line-mates (look at his linemates in Anaheim). He was just really bad. And he was only really bad for us, and that one year for Colorado. So fuck you, Teemu, even though I know your knee injury was a big part of your poor play.
Picklesnakebit since 2011.
@shampeon
In his defense
It’s hard to skate with a bum knee. He didn’t truly recover until the lockout when he sat for an entire season.
GO SHARKS!
True dat.
But why did we trade for a finesse winger with a bum knee? If we needed a guy to not score on breakaways and miss wide-open nets, we could have kept Friesen, who at least played defense moderately well. And could score in Game 7 in the playoffs (ask a Ducks fan about this one).
Picklesnakebit since 2011.
@shampeon
Ask Sutter
I think we just needed an elite scorer and rolled the dice. Honestly I thought he was on the downside of his career when he left the Sharks. What he has done after the lockout is a testament to him, and to what some real recovery time does for significant knee injuries.
GO SHARKS!
We traded the finesse winger with a bum knee
For a finesse winger with a bum shoulder!
And yeah, I miss Friesen!
GO SHARKS!
They're not getting this kind of coverage at "Hockey Night In Canada" folks! - Randy Hahn
Changing signatures is for suckers.
What Jay Leach is to the San Jose Shark's Defense, I am to Fear The Fin's Mod Squad.
Am I disappointed that you guys didn’t just go “Thanks for Havlat”?
Yes
Hell on Ice/In Lou We Trust/Twitter
That's it. I'm sending you to El Paso to live with your real parents.
by Kevin Sellathamby on Oct 12, 2011 4:50 AM PDT reply actions
The Dany Heatley trade
was one of the rare “all-around Win-Win for everybody” moves, where everyone gets something they need.
Dany Heatley: keeps his monster salary, gets a shot with a new team on a great line (with Seto and Koivu)
Wild Organization: gets a player with great scoring upside and renewed motivation, a figure to re-energize the fan base
Sharks Organization: gets enough cap space to lock-up Couture and Burns long-term, added speed in the top-6 in Havlat without losing much scoring
Havlat: A shot with a contending team after a pretty stagnant stay in Minn, a fresh start with lowered expectations and not having to be counted on as a top point producer
Bon Voyage
I really won’t miss Dany because of his lackluster performance with SJ. Injuries were very likely a good part of why he struggled but I’ve always maintained that he wasn’t giving good value for his salary and that hurts the team in so many ways. He also wasn’t a complete player and I hope that Havlat will succeed, I wish Dany well but I really don’t feel strongly about him either way. I was watching the MIN/OTT game last night and he looked to be having fun and was really into the game; much like he was in his first season with SJ. It’s funny how OTT fans would anticipate their booing when the puck was headed his way. Now those people have an opinion for sure. Seto looked like a man on the ice and they played well along side one another and with Koivu MIN should see the scoring pop they’ve lacked. Bottom line, I miss Seto most.
derp.
Ok lets get down to brass tacks here
Did BOTH of you get into the Star Wars: The Old Republic beta??
It’s only been 3 games, but I’m kind of disappointed that Heater and Seto didn’t play like this consistently.
But at the same time, it doesn’t really matter. I was disappointed to see both of them go, and I do hope they play well in Minny. I really don’t feel about either of them… it’s just too bad it didn’t work out. Maybe Seto will be back in 4 years ;)
"Logan Couture is a dirty, filthy man. Tell all your friends" - Mr. Plank
Welcome to the NHL, Atlanta Thrashers of Winnipeg.
It’s only been 3 games, but I’m kind of disappointed that Heater and Seto didn’t play like this consistently.
Yeah, but they still have to play like that consistently. Who knows what the rest of the season will be like for them?
Proud member of the "Bring Back Semenov" Club
"The only crying allowed in hockey is when you lose a playoff series, retire or JR is speaking publicly." - Jamie Baker
"You are down with the homies, my friend." - Randy Hahn
Kent Huskins cares.
"Don't fart on my chair mutha fuckah!" - Randy Hahn
"Pavs with great feed but what a release by Wingels Peanut Butter Baby!"" - Jamie Baker
Guess I’m just hearing the news that some in SJ are rooting for Heatley to fail. Damn. I still clearly remember his first game with us and how thrilled everyone was with him. So let me get this straight, unless someone scores 3 every night, you can just toss your affection to the curb? haha
Not to rain on the Wild any, but perhaps it is easier to excel there than San Jose seeing how they don’t have the offensive power we have. Heatley was just another that could score. I don’t know, could be wrong. But there he can shine.
I hope he does well, both him and Setoguchi.
GO SHARKS!
Ever get the feeling we are on a collision course with reality?
"They who would give up an essential liberty for temporary security, deserve neither liberty or security" -- Benjamin Franklin (see profile for more info on this quote)
The hat trick game wasnt his first for the Sharks, it was just the first home game… he had close to zero points if not zero points the first few road games that season, which people didnt like… and there’s a difference between scoring a hat trick every night, and actually working on your conditioning enough so that those kinds of performances are more likely. People don’t dislike him because he didnt score 3 goals every night… they dislike him because of his poor effort last year.
Yeah that’s what I meant – first home game – and considering the hour, I think most knew that. :)
As far as poor effort, did any of his team mates complain about his poor effort? I don’t recall so. No one here knows what was going on – if there was lingering injury issues or not. Second guessing is just that – guessing. Disliking a guy for something you have no clue about is a joke.
He has not bad mouthed the Sharks, no reason we should do so to him.
GO SHARKS!
Ever get the feeling we are on a collision course with reality?
"They who would give up an essential liberty for temporary security, deserve neither liberty or security" -- Benjamin Franklin (see profile for more info on this quote)
I don't disagree with you at all here
But when was the last time we heard a Sharks player bad mouth another Sharks player? Other than hearing that Ron Wilson is a tremendous asshole, I haven’t heard any negative comments ever come out of the dressing room. I could be wrong…
GO SHARKS!
I remember Nabby calling out Pickles (although not by name, but it was implied).
Proud member of the "Bring Back Semenov" Club
"The only crying allowed in hockey is when you lose a playoff series, retire or JR is speaking publicly." - Jamie Baker
"You are down with the homies, my friend." - Randy Hahn
Kent Huskins cares.
"Don't fart on my chair mutha fuckah!" - Randy Hahn
"Pavs with great feed but what a release by Wingels Peanut Butter Baby!"" - Jamie Baker
He called him out point blank for not blocking a shot.
Fear the Fin: "I've always said that if you don't have the motivation within you... It's not Doug Wilson's job to motivate me. I've got motivation within myself, especially going through some of the experiences that I had last year." - Nick Petrecki
by Matthew_Taylor on Oct 12, 2011 4:12 PM PDT up reply actions
And Vlasic owned up to it, too.
http://penaltykill.net/blogs/san-jose-sharks-evgeni-nabokov-calls-out-vlasic/ He had to be asked a bit, but he did it.
Dumb and Dumber
What was the Dumb and Dumber reference he made??
WE LANDED ON THE MOON!
I actually have no idea.
Proud member of the "Bring Back Semenov" Club
"The only crying allowed in hockey is when you lose a playoff series, retire or JR is speaking publicly." - Jamie Baker
"You are down with the homies, my friend." - Randy Hahn
Kent Huskins cares.
"Don't fart on my chair mutha fuckah!" - Randy Hahn
"Pavs with great feed but what a release by Wingels Peanut Butter Baby!"" - Jamie Baker
WHERES MY BUYOUT CALCULATOR!!!!!
I think its too early in the season to really think either one will have better years with the Wild then their time with the Sharks, and if they do, well good for them. I think the energy of the trade is still fresh in their minds and they have caught some by suprise, by the end of the month I think teams will have adjusted.
Watching the game last night, I cheered when Seto got a goal, but also was reminded of both of their own zone play. Heatley being booed everytime he touched the puck and Neil being cheered everytime he put Heatley to the ice was funny.
I think Seto gets 25-30 goals and Heatley around the same, for Wild fans and a team who hasnt made the playoffs in a while that is HUGE. But at the end of the day, the Sharks are better for this trade.
Expectations
I think that a lot of people were unhappy with Heatley because he wasn’t the goal scorer they expected him to be, especially in the playoffs (and with that $7.5mm cap hit). I never expected him to be a 50 goal scorer in San Jose, the team has way too much talent and the offence was never going to run through him/his line the way it did in Ottawa.
If you look at his playoff history, he’s never been a goal scorer…
Last season he & Couture were the two best players through December. He had 36pts in 38 games (I stopped at Dec 30th). He worked at his two way game and did just about everything McLellan asked of him. He was a good teammate by all accounts.
He wasn’t great in the playoffs, the two years he was in SJ he went into the playoffs w/ some sort of pretty significant injury…not an excuse since he still played, but pretty unlucky on his part.
This trade was an under-performing player for an under-performing player, Heatley is exactly what the Wild needed and we’ll see if Havlat is what the Sharks need.
It’s 3 games into their season so it’s an extremely small sample size to say that both he and Seto have shed their “issues”…but both guys are being given a really good opportunity to succeed with LOTS of ice time and an elite center. I hope they help the Wild make the playoffs and I’ll be cheering for both of them.
You hit the nail on the head with the cap hit.
I would have been far less happy with the trade had Havlat been making the same money. Heatley just wasn’t worth the money. The end result of player movement, strong team core + lots of trade deadline wiggle room, makes me very happy.
I would rather be happy than right any day.
by SouthBayernMunchen on Oct 12, 2011 12:22 PM PDT up reply actions
I still really like Heatley
I felt like he got the short end of the stick thanks to Ottawa, and found I have no problem rooting for Heater while watching the Wild play. I typically root for players that are traded from the Sharks organization, I still root for Carle, I rooted for Rivet… Really the only player traded that I didn’t root for was Ehrhoff, and that’s mostly because he did some shit talking at some point and it didn’t sit well with me.
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I was never all that enamored with Ehrhoff anyway.
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Yeah, for some reason, I never liked Ehrhoff.
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For some reason his talents were always just wide of my expectations and likings. Could never figure it out…
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by tealstherealdeal92 on Oct 12, 2011 1:37 PM PDT up reply actions 4 recs
/rimshot!
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You know – I don’t care for this article. I’m just going to come right out and say it. We’ve had other players go and they have never been singled out for this type of article – how should we feel about them now that they are gone. Heatley, with how he’s perceived around the NHL, should not also be treated like this from San Jose. It is just shameful.
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by Angy on Oct 12, 2011 8:15 AM PDT reply actions 1 recs
I got the feeling that the article would help alleviate any negative feelings people might be harboring for Heatley, so that particular SJ fans are not ragging on him or wishing him ill-will.
by Bearodactyls on Oct 12, 2011 8:21 AM PDT up reply actions
How exactly are we treating him. And what about any of this is shameful? Plank is rooting for him, I don’t care either way. What should we be ashamed about, please tell.
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by Matthew_Taylor on Oct 12, 2011 8:36 AM PDT via iPhone app up reply actions 1 recs
No one is treating the situation with any disrespect....
First off: the Sharks took over Heaters contract for GOALS…When he didn’t produce, he gave the organization the idea of a trade….He did not give SJ a good enough reason to sustain his current contract… Havlat for Heatly??? Pfffft (Great move). I think we all wish Heater the best, but you won’t see me rooting for him…(it’s kind of like an ex-girlfriend…She was extremley attractive and full of potential at the beginning…but after a while, She didn’t look so good and she wasn’t worth the money Soooo, good bye and good luck kind of)…
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Will Harris San Jose - Sacramento
by will_hunter23 on Oct 12, 2011 8:53 AM PDT up reply actions
I really need to work on my grammar...Shaiza
"Now your gunna get it Bobby" -Happy
Will Harris San Jose - Sacramento
by will_hunter23 on Oct 12, 2011 8:54 AM PDT up reply actions
I think
she’s talking more about the fact that why should this even be an issue?
It’s not so much what you’re saying about him, but the fact that you deemed it necessary to even have this conversation and make an entire post about it.
Personally, I’m a bit ambivalent about this post.
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by PNK on Oct 12, 2011 9:26 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
I’m ambivilant about your face.
Fear the Fin: "I've always said that if you don't have the motivation within you... It's not Doug Wilson's job to motivate me. I've got motivation within myself, especially going through some of the experiences that I had last year." - Nick Petrecki
by Matthew_Taylor on Oct 12, 2011 9:30 AM PDT up reply actions
Or ambivalent, even.
Fear the Fin: "I've always said that if you don't have the motivation within you... It's not Doug Wilson's job to motivate me. I've got motivation within myself, especially going through some of the experiences that I had last year." - Nick Petrecki
by Matthew_Taylor on Oct 12, 2011 9:30 AM PDT up reply actions
Ha ha
I was just making a joke. I don’t mind that a post was amde about it, just offering a possible explanation of why someone might not like it.
Personally, I’m still a Heatley fan and I’ve had a growing semi-fandom of the Wild for a while now, so it’s just all the more reason to root for him and them.
And he is a polarizing figure and I know some people don’t like him, so I don’t think the post is inappropriate.
Plus, we don’t play until Friday so we needed to talk about SOMETHING.
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I’m thinking it may have something to do with other markets hating the guy by default. I never blamed him for wanting out of Ottawa nor do I blame him for saying “no” to Edmonton. He comes with controversy yet was popular with a lot of Sharks fans. I’m glad we’re free of a major cap hit for a one-way player but I hold no ill will towards him. It’s all ripe for discussion.
derp.
BWAHAHAHAHA!
Shame on you Plank and Matt for discussing your opinions in an entertaining article
by sharkblood99 on Oct 12, 2011 9:30 AM PDT up reply actions
WHAT HAVE I DONNNNNNNNNNNEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
Fear the Fin: "I've always said that if you don't have the motivation within you... It's not Doug Wilson's job to motivate me. I've got motivation within myself, especially going through some of the experiences that I had last year." - Nick Petrecki
by Matthew_Taylor on Oct 12, 2011 9:31 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
I think all youve done is give her more ammo for the “complain about FTF across the blog-o-sphere” campaign shes got going on and get to read when I visit other teams blogs.
by sharkblood99 on Oct 12, 2011 10:28 AM PDT up reply actions 3 recs
Marcel Goc doesn’t bring in the page hits like Heatley does though you know what I’m sayin’?
In all seriousness though, I understand your concern Ang. That makes sense. I would still publish it anyways because I think it’s a good tie in with his return to Ottawa, and felt like I did a good job making the case as to why he should be praised for his service with the organization, but I understand where you are coming from and truly appreciate the feedback.
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Lets be honest here
You saw an opportunity to break your record for Star Wars references in one post.
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I get what you’re saying, but I also think you’re wrong.
He isn’t being treated poorly here. It’s just another discussion point, and moreso because there isn’t some sort of “oh look what he did to us!” moment like they had in Ottawa. It’s an interesting debate too. I was a bit disappointed by his season last year, but there seemed to be an underlying reason. He didn’t tank on purpose.
It seems like a lot of people actually hope to see both Heater and Seto do well. Both were traded away (most likely) against their wishes… who’d want to leave San Jose (Teemu!)?
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Welcome to the NHL, Atlanta Thrashers of Winnipeg.
I like the fact that he's trying for a team like the Wild
You could argue that he is trying to redeem himself, but he is doing it with a team that really needs some help and I applaud that. I’m glad he’s healthy enough now to make this push and I look forward to seeing how he plays his role as a leader on a struggling team. I have high hopes for what Havlat can do with the Sharks, but I am not impressed with the casually accepted theory that he had trouble playing well for Minny because they were not contenders. If that were verifiable, I would consider it a more problematic character flaw than anything Heatley is accused of. But since it cannot truly be verified I won’t judge.
Similarly, we can’t verify the whys and wherefores of what brought Heatley’s performance down in SJ. Even at his worst, he contributed significantly to the team’s success. Now he has his work cut out for him in Minny and, at least so far, he seems willing to give it his best shot.
So I’m rooting for him.
I hope Heatley succeeds, but not too much.
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I would be a bit annoyed if he won the Rocket Richard with them.
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Heatley's "Three Controversies"
In regards to Heatley’s trials and tribulations (his “Three Controversies” as follows: the car accident, the trade request, and the underachieving), these two points made by Plank really struck a note with me:
I don’t see an overarching theme between the three. If anything, he’s just displaying the traits of your normal everyday run of the mill human being.
I live in LA amongst a few avid Kings fans who can’t help but knock the other CA teams, especially the Sharks. I have defended Heatley countless times because stat-mongering pundits (both outside and within) can’t see anything beyond their blinders. A player’s personal life affects their game, bug time. He overcame a lot to remain an elite player in the NHL. In his run season, I thought he displayed a lot of heart and courage to play, for all intents and purposes, an entire NHL season with significant injuries.
I am willing to bet that the transactions between the Sharks and the Wild were actually one big transaction. San Jose got active, elite talent in trade to the Wild for active, elite talent, period. I do not think the Wild would have accepted a basket case for Burns and Havlat.
I sincerely wish him, Seto, and the Wild the best of fortunes. I am still sad they went. But the moves were absolutely NEEDED and I couldn’t be more excited as a Sharks fan. I think the Sharks’ organization handled the situation fairly; a clear win-win for both sides. It was a matter of a team having a certain plan and making the moves to make it a reality.
Lastly, what the hell do I know? I just can’t wait for the season to start again.
He was my neighbor
He seemed like a really good guy. Unlike a lot of players, he came here and bought instead of renting. He was planning on being here a long time. The media was hard on him. He was out of shape and injured. It’s all just unfortunate.
I wish him the best.
Wishing Heatley nothing but the best....
I may have a different perspective because my old boss used to work for the Sharks organization and is good friends with a lot of people that still work for the formerly SVSE. So if my opinion differs from some of you, this is why.
I have been following Dany since he was a Thrasher. I’ve always admired his skill and just his flat out talent. In Ottawa, when he asked for a trade, yeah it never looks good. He even admitted that it probably didn’t do him any favors in terms of his reputation in the media and to hockey fans. But let’s be honest, the Sens management had a HUGE part in why this whole thing spun out of control. They were the ones who had this so public. Do you think a ton of other players don’t ask for trades? The real issue is, what GM’s and ownership don’t have enough class to keep this stuff in house and not totally drag it all through the media mud? Also, yeah Heatley refused Edmonton but when Ottawa gave him the contract, they knew he had a NTC where he could actually use his rights to waive or not waive his deal. If Clouston was the reason he left, obviously Heatley knew something because he didn’t do much with the Sens after Heatley left anyway.
When Dany came to San Jose, I thought he was a great fit. The guy scored 39 goals on HTML and was a point per game player. The guy had a pretty bad groin injury right before playoffs. Even though he only scored 2 goals the first post season in San Jose, he still had 13 points in 14 games. Not bad. The groin injury did not heal by the time training camp started for the 10-11 season. Due to the injury not making him 100%, TMac started putting Heatley on the 2nd line. In my opinion, I think Heatley should have sat out the first part of the season and get that groin taken care of but that’s neither here nor there. But when on the 2nd line WITHOUT JUMBO (a pure goalscorer SHOULD be with the best playmaker on the team) he scored 64 points. Then the guy gets a broken hand right before playoffs. So not only do you have a broken hand, he still has that groin injury… that’s when the dissapointing 9 points in 18 games in the playoffs begin.
Now after the loss to the Canucks, I was told Heatley actually had surgery on his groin finally. In fact he didn’t go on the annual Vegas trip as well due to the surgery. I truly believe the fact that his groin was finally healed AND the fact that Wilson gave him up (and although probably not intentional, made him the scapegoat of not winning a Cup), that is why he’s in such good shape. If I was Dany, I’d be 150% motivated to proving Doug Wilson wrong. Maybe if he was still with San Jose right now, he would be reunited with Joe and be back to the PPG player he was in 09-10. I actually really believe this would be the case although I know a lot of you don’t agree.
I am happy that we were able to clear some cap space to sign Burns and Couture but I also don’t really believe the fans nor some of Sharks management gave Heatley a fair shake. And if Havlat is such a “great player”, why the resentment that Dany is doing well on another team?
I wish he (and Seto) nothing but success in Minnesota. I hope he proves all the nay sayers wrong. I predicted he will be back to 80+ points and 35-40 goals this season… I just hope none of those goals are against the Sharks. ;)
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Wow… that was really long… hey FTF, need another blog writer? ;)
Waiting for the Cup to come to SJ since 1991...
GO SHARKS!
Find me on Twitter @njahoda
Not enough Star Wars… sorry.
Fear the Fin: "I've always said that if you don't have the motivation within you... It's not Doug Wilson's job to motivate me. I've got motivation within myself, especially going through some of the experiences that I had last year." - Nick Petrecki
by Matthew_Taylor on Oct 12, 2011 8:49 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Damn it… does it count that I pretty much can quote the original 3 by heart? Or that Mark Hamill as Luke was my first celebrity crush when I was 5 years old (just ignore the fact he aged horribly)? Haha!
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That's kreeeeepy ^^^ lol
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by will_hunter23 on Oct 12, 2011 8:58 AM PDT up reply actions
Whoa, Dany Heatley is an alternate captain in Minnesota?
I was happy to see both Heater and Seto do well in their first game with the Wild. I never got the sense Heatley didn’t put in the effort, just that his body didn’t let him do what he used to be able to do.
I also don’t think he was the best fit with the team. Pavelski, Seto, and Cheechoo are proof that if you are going to be a spot up shooter on Joe Thornton’s line, you have to be right handed (Marleau succeeds because of his speed, and really would do and has done well on any line). Sheer talent got Heater 39 goals his first year, but nobody (except Wellwood) was able to consistently feed Heatley in his prime sniping zone.
He had an A on his sweater last night. I kept thinking how he’s got to be the quietest person in all of captaincy.
derp.
It's a Shared A
Healtey shares the A with Matt Cullen. First half the season Cullen has the A at home, Heatley on the road. Second half they switch.
Wait
is Heatley an Alternate Captain in Minnesota?
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I believe I heard last night watching the Wild/Sens game that he is the alternate on road games. Kind of like Marleau and Clowe switch off.
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I read this...
as being said by Chris Farley in Billy Madison.
Just so you know…
by HeatersLeadingLady on Oct 13, 2011 10:57 PM PDT up reply actions
You can't be mad at Heatley
Because the Sharks are the one that made the move. We at FTF were more or less skeptical of the Heatley/Havlat trade because many thought last season was a down year from him and this year would be a healthier more productive season. I personally thought we sold too low on Heatley and was excited to see him come back and play this year.
If he succeeds on the Wild, take it as an “I told you so” from all the people who hadn’t lost faith in Heatley, but don’t be mad at Heatley himself
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by waive kent huskins on Oct 12, 2011 9:44 AM PDT reply actions
I still miss Heatley...
Loved the move to get him; loved him while he was here; admired, greatly, his willingness to play through injury when we needed him most. He seemed to really love it here, and really wanted to help this team win the Cup. I hate that he’s turned into the new Nabokov (the scapegoat for why we haven’t won a Cup yet). It’s really not his fault. I’d like to see anyone tear their groin and break their hand and then go skate hard for 20 minutes a night in the most difficult postseason in all of professional sports.
I still think the trade of Heatley for Havlat was a huge mistake, but that’s just me. If the reason for trading Heatley is you thought he’d never get healthy, you don’t trade him for someone who has an even worse health track record and a year longer contract. If the reason you are trading Heatley is you think he sucks in the playoffs, well, that seems to be giving up on someone rather quickly who had yet to actually have a somewhat healthy postseason with us.
So, that being said, I fully expect Heatley to have 40 goals and 80+ points this year. And I fully expect Havlat to wind up in the 50-55 point area and be hurt from time to time. And I fully expect the Sharks to regret this trade. I hope we don’t, but its what I expect. And I will cheer for Heatley and his rise. Loved the guy here, he wanted to stay, so there’s no reason to be mad at him. At all.
Just hopefully he doesn’t knock the Sharks out of the playoffs in the first round with an OT GWG,
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by ZeroIndulgence on Oct 12, 2011 10:07 AM PDT reply actions 5 recs
I agree with most of what you said
but the trade helped us secure Burns and Couture.
If it would have been possible to do that without trading Heatley, then I’d agree with you, but I don’t know if it is.
TBH, I viewed the trade strictly as a salary dump, a la Ehrhoff.
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Yeah, it would have been close...
I just don’t really see it as a huge salary dump, since we added an extra year of a 5 million dollar player who gets hurt a lot. Seems like we could have done a better job in truly dumping salary, or getting a better player for someone like Heatley. Or at least someone with a shorter contract.
I’m not overly pissed about the idea of trading Heatley in general (although I think he will be a monster this year, which would be nice to have around here)…just not at all a fan of the return.
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by ZeroIndulgence on Oct 12, 2011 10:35 AM PDT up reply actions
I’m reserving judgment on Havlat for now. We’ll see.
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I actually don't think we could have dont much better
than getting Havlat for Heatley, contract wise and talent wise.
Even though it was a salary dump for us, you knew Minnesota had to send one of their larger contracts our way to make it financially worthwhile for both teams. They weren’t going to let us unload a 7.5MM guy on them and say “Hey, how about one of our best value contracts in return?”
Also, talent-wise, I honestly think Havlat was about as good a player as we could have gotten at the time for Heatley. Heatley’s stock was abysmal when the trade was made. Severely underperforming season, weak playoff showing, 2 years straight with injuries/conditioning troubles. Not many teams were going to take a shot on that for 7.5MM.
by BillytheSid on Oct 12, 2011 10:46 AM PDT up reply actions
Severely underperfoming season: Not playing with Jumbo because he was injured but still scored 64 points on a line without the best playmaker on the team. Considering his injury, that’s not bad.
Weak playoff showing: This past postseason, yes I’ll give you that. The year before he was just shy of a PPG in the playoffs. Let’s look at Patrick Marleau. He scored 13 in 14 games the 2010 playoffs (same as Heatley)… scored 13 points in 18 games in the 2011 postseason- On a line with Joe Thornton who played like a beast through all 3 rounds. I’m not hating on Marleau (I really like the guy) but just comparing.
2 years straight with injuries/conditioning troubles: You think Havlat’s history of injuries is an upgrade in this department? Look who’s playing right now and who isn’t.
But yes, the cap space was needed. I’ll give you that.
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It’s not hard for a former 50 goal scorer to rack up a few points playing anywhere in our top 6, and playing on our top PP unit every night. For a guy who’s billed as a pure goal scorer, i expected Heatley to score goals, and lots of them. 5 goals in 32 playoff games is just unacceptable.
Marleau scored 3 times as many goals as Heatley did in those same 32 playoff games, and even still Marleau was being called out for his performance. So if a guy who’s getting called out for not playing well enough has 15 more goals than you, a pure goal scorer, then you’re probably not doing so hot.
I really don’t like the injury excuses either. If he had an injury half way into the season he should’ve sat out and let it heal instead of trying to be a hero or something when we didn’t really need one.
Oh and even though Heatley got nearly a PPG in his first playoff run with us, that year he was an absolute defensive liability. Several of his defensive miscues led to game-winning goals against us in those playoffs.
This last playoff run Heatley played great defensively imo. He actually seemed to backcheck a bit and i thought he even played great on the PK, but he didn’t score goals and didn’t even put up many points despite being on our top PP unit.
Yeah it just dawned on me recently how bad Havlat’s contract is.
I was thinking about Milan Michalek and how i wish we could get him back, until i remembered he had a 4.3 million dollar contract. Then i started to realize how similar Michalek is to Havlat and how Havlat’s cap hit is even higher at 5 mill (and has an extra year on it).
When Michalek was with us he averaged around 25 goals and 60 points just like Havlat has throughout most of his career. They’re both really fast skaters and they’re both capable of playing a good 2 way game. They also both seem to have a lot of injury issues.
I do think Havlat is a much better player though. I think the reason their stats are so similar is because Michalek has always played with some of the best players in the game (Thornton, Marleau, Spezza, Alfredsson) while Havlat hasn’t really had that opportunity yet. Last year I believe Havlat played on a line with Matt Cullen and Clutterbuck, and then the year before with Latendresse and Brodziak. In Chicago i believe Havlat played with Andrew Ladd and Dave Bolland.
So I really can’t wait for Havlat to get healthy so we can finally see what he looks like playing with some really good players that are actually on the same level as him. Until then (and until we see how Heatley looks down the stretch or in the playoffs), I don’t think it’s worth analyzing the Heatley/Havlat trade.
So in the same post
You call Havlat’s contract bad, and then wish for Michalek…
Bi-polar much? :P
Havlat is easily a better player than Michalek, and both are about as oft-injured, so really, I think we come out ahead.
GO SHARKS!
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No i wished for Michalek, then remember he had a bad contract, then realized Havlat’s contract wasn’t so great either.
Michalek is nearly identical to Havlat on paper, and yet he has a cheaper contract than Havlat – a contract that most would consider pretty terrible.
As I was saying though, i think Havlat has yet to play his best hockey in this league. He’s never played with teammates of his own caliber, but that will hopefully change soon and we’ll hopefully be able to see what kind of player Havlat really is.
Oh man, if Michalek ever even approached Havlat’s current capabilities the Senators would be stoked.
Havlat’s PPG career is 0.82, Michalek’s is 0.62. In the playoffs, Havlat’s PPG is 0.73 while Michalek’s is 0.40. Even if those seem similar enough, Havlat has been either maintaining his production or increasing it over the last 5 years, while Michalek’s numbers have nosedived.
Havlat is a 2nd line winger (now) on a good team. Michalek is a 3rd line winger on a bad team. Havlat is a country mile better than Michalek at his absolute best.
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Well his PPG has dropped a lot now that he’s playing on a terrible Sens team.
If Michalek had never left the sharks he would probably still be scoring around 25 goals and 60 points a season just as he did every year he was with us other than his rookie year (3 consecutive years).
Anyways, i’ve already said several times that Havlat is a much better player so I don’t even know what we’re arguing about.
Havlat is going to be a monster playing on our top 6 if he can get healthy.
I guess the term “violent agreement” is in play here.
Michalek’s knee injury is no doubt a factor in his decline. He definitely doesn’t seem to be the player he was when he was here, but he was a pretty streaky scorer even with Jumbo (in his prime) feeding him.
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Playing on a line with Spezza and Alfredson isn’t exactly a black hole of scoring. Senators may be bad, but they’ve got some top end talent.
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omg no one reads
Me: Michalek has always played with some of the best players in the game (Thornton, Marleau, Spezza, Alfredsson)
I dunno how often Michalek plays with them though, but yeah his goal totals didn’t drop very much in his first year (22 goals in 66 games) when he was playing most often with them.
Zero- I agree with everything you just said. Rec’d!
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by winthecupsj on Oct 12, 2011 10:42 AM PDT up reply actions
I respect how tough Heatley was to play through his injuries, but i think it ended up really hurting the team. I wonder if he even fully disclosed his injuries to our training staff. I get the feeling that when Heatley was asked about his health he would almost always respond with something like, “I feel good. I’m healthy. I can play.” even if he had an injury that was progressively getting worse throughout the season.
For example, the groin injury he sustained in the playoffs in his first year here – that’s something that he should’ve taken the time to fully recover from. He should’ve sat out half the season if he needed to so that he could be healthy for the playoffs. Instead he played on day one of the preseason and didn’t miss a single game all year long (other than the 2 games he got suspended for). Even during/after the playoffs he told the media he was 100% healthy, and then it comes out that he had a broken hand, an ankle injury, and possibly a groin and knee injury. I’m sure Heatley just wanted to be there for his teammates by not missing any games, but in the end it just wasn’t a smart way to go about things and it may have cost us dearly in the playoffs.
I voted for ambivalence because i’d like to think that DW knows his stuff and made a good evaluation of Heatley (and Havlat), but i also do like Heatley and hope he can continue to be a great player. I won’t mind if Heatley wins the Rocket Richard this year, as long as we win the cup lol.
It's nearly impossible
To hide a groin injury from a training staff that works with you every day. You’re either giving Heatley a shit ton of credit, or giving our training staff absolutely none.
It’s not like they have nothing to go on but his word, there are simple exercises to determine a players range of motion and how much power they can put into their legs.
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Yeah i’m sure the training staff had a good idea that Heatley had some lingering injuries. Who knows why they didn’t force him to sit out. Maybe they did try to test him and he just gutted it out. I imagine it went something like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-yiMuXj_ayc&feature=player_detailpage#t=50s
Maybe he just vehemently refused and they respected his decision; and when he ended up being ineffective in the playoffs they felt somewhat betrayed and maybe that’s why he got traded. Who really knows, but i guarantee Heatley unnecessarily played games during the regular season while experiencing some kind of injury that he should’ve/could’ve sat out to rehab.
I really doubt they felt betrayed if Heatley chose to play. I think they needed a scapegoat AND they needed cap space, so Heatley was the one to go.
The training staff knew full well of Heatley’s injuries. The guy had a groin injury for a year and a half, kind of hard to hide that sort of thing. And I think we know TMac probably doesn’t have a problem with making a player sit out (except for Niemi- all he has to do is smile and he’s in haha).
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This post
Expressed every single one of my feelings better than I could have.
by HeatersLeadingLady on Oct 12, 2011 11:27 AM PDT via mobile up reply actions
Perfectly stated
I can understand the attitude of someone like Matt who’s simply ambivalent to Heatley, but the active hate on the part of some San Jose fans just seems petty.
Heatley WANTED to be here, he WANTED to stay, and played through injury for us. He kept his mouth shut, always said the right things, and played hard. We KNOW his production was curtailed by injury, and WE shipped him out.
Atlanta and Ottawa fans have cause for active hate. San Jose fans have almost none, and whatever cause they have can’t be as strong as the reasons we have for liking him.
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He kept his mouth shut, always said the right things,
Wow, that takes some serious talent to accomplish simultaneously!
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by tealstherealdeal92 on Oct 12, 2011 1:19 PM PDT up reply actions
Heatley: why quiet guys lose PR battles
Jeremy Roenick is an asshole with a giant ego and a biggger mouth, and is beloved. Heatley minds his tongue and gets repeatedly dick-punched by fans.
His injuries, and willingness to play through them, limited his effectiveness. We needed a bull with a wicked accurate shot in front of the net. We got a one-armed forward with average speed. I don’t blame Heatley for his injuries, and I don’t blame the Sharks for dealing him. I wish Dany well in Minnesota.
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Don Cherry is an asshole with a giant ego and a bigger mouth. Not so beloved.
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Check out the comments thread in the recent Puck Daddy piece about Don Cherry. It’s about how Cherry’s going too far by calling some ex-enforcers, who think the NHL and NHLPA should be doing more to prevent tragedies like Wade Belak, Derek Boogard, and Rypien, “hypocrites” and “pukes.”
Cherry and his old-timey nonsense is most certainly beloved up North.
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I did browse that thread of comments
It smelled very much of meat and heads
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Wow – lengthy discussion here.
I don’t hold grudges against anyone who’s been traded, especially Heatley who was shocked when he learned the news. Yes he looked out of step last season and disengaged. But so did most of the team until January. Couture and Clowe were the only ones who had their hearts beating.
With that said, I won’t feel good about the trade until Havlat actually plays a game for the Sharks. Love his talent, but I’ve always been scared of his injury history. And what does he do as a brand new Shark? He starts by missing games.
For now, Doug Wilson looks like a loser in that trade and it’ll only look worse and worse the more games Havlat is our with his historically fragile shoulders.
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I think its a little early to make that judgement on Havlat
I mean I know he has a history, but he has only missed one game. Not just one game, but the first game where we had a weeks break until the second.
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by tealstherealdeal92 on Oct 12, 2011 11:47 AM PDT up reply actions
I think the only time Wilson will be judged by this trade is after the playoffs. I don’t care if Havlat misses 50 regular season games this year – if he shows up and produces in the playoffs helping the team to the SCF, Wilson will have won the trade.
As rediculous as it may seem, this team (and all of management’s moves) will always be judged by it’s playoff performance.
by milanahalek on Oct 12, 2011 2:15 PM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
Very, very true...
If we win a Stanley Cup, then every move made to get us there was perfect and correct and amazing. Guess we’ll just have to wait through this annoying nuisance called the “regular season.” Sigh…
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by ZeroIndulgence on Oct 12, 2011 2:21 PM PDT up reply actions
Nice summary of what I said there – sigh…
I didn’t say that winning a cup will justify the moves. I said Wilson (and every guy on the team) will be judged by how far this team goes in the playoffs.
I actually don’t care how Havlat produces in the regular seaon, same as I didn’t care about Thornton’s big drop in production last year. I don’t think anyone anywhere thinks this team won’t make the playoffs. It’s what they do when they get there that matters.
lol well you should’ve said that cuz it’s totally true, and i don’t think Zero was being sarcastic like you seem to think he was.
Its true...
I was being serious. I’ll even love Niemi if the Sharks win a Cup. Winning a Cup proves all the right moves were made because the team will have achieved ultimate success…
"If you can accept losing, you can't win." ~Vince Lombardi
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by ZeroIndulgence on Oct 13, 2011 11:34 AM PDT up reply actions
If we win a Stanley Cup, then every move made to get us there was perfect and correct and amazing.
Just like how trading for Jose Guillen was the perfect move for the Giants to win the WS last year! (Couldn’t pass up one more opportunity ;D)
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It clearly was...
Since they won it all…
Ugh, now I need to go forget last October all over again. Thanks for that.
"If you can accept losing, you can't win." ~Vince Lombardi
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by ZeroIndulgence on Oct 13, 2011 11:34 AM PDT up reply actions
Oh, my pleasure.
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We'll see
I mean how do you get rid of a player that costs as much as heatley and still get something of value in return. If Havlat has a good year be it this year or next (I don’t know if he has a trade clause or what it’s like if he does but) he’ll be a lot easier to trade then Heatley was. And the team will have more of a chance to save even more money if/when they do. With him on one of the top 2 lines and the core being set for the next 2 or 3 years I don’t see why Havlat won’t be able to show what he’s worth. I think he’s no better then 4 mil a year but at the same time Heatley isn’t excatly worth his contract either. So hopefully he can go another what 2 or 3 seasons without having to go through another surgery again and I think the Sharks will be alright.
Trade him to Montreal (Gomez) or Florida (Campbell)?
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I have no hard feelings toward Heater- I really liked the guy. I could tell he genuinely liked being part of the organization; however I think on the ice he very much took that for granted. He did not show that commitment on the ice weather it was post season or regular season last year and I saw now signs that would change in the upcoming one.
The way I see Heatley is he plays well when surrounded by praise and hype. If he is going to be “the guy” on his team and is praised as such, he will perform. On the other hand if he is on a team loaded with talent such as San Jose where praise is fairly evenly distributed amongst a set of players, he tends to just disappear. Now that he is playing in Minnesota, he really is their all-star player and he will succeed in that environment. But hey, those are just my two cents on the topic.
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by tealstherealdeal92 on Oct 12, 2011 11:45 AM PDT reply actions
Heater just wasn't right to get us over the hump
Hi Everyone, new member here but long time reader/follower of FTF and a Sharks fan since the beginning, attending games at the infamous Cow Palace.
I just wanted to chime in on this conversation over Heatley…
We all know DW is a genius as a GM and we should trust that he knows whats best for our organization, thus giving me confidence in this trade for Havlat. Yes, getting cap space to lock up Cooch and Burns was important to this trade but the real reason why it was needed is because DW feels that Havlat is the type of player we need to get us over the hump. Let me explain. Even a 100% healthy Heatley, though a potential 40+ goal scorer on a talented Sharks team, just doesn’t fit into what we need in order to get into the finals, not even to mention win the Cup. You have to realize we’re not thinking about beating good teams on a nightly basis but thinking about beating the top 3, 4 teams in the entire league because we’re looking at the Conference Finals/Finals. That being said, a 100% healthy Heatley was and will be, even as an elite player potentially like he was, is a player that relies on his sniper of a shot in the slot being fed by talented wingers/centermen (and possibly his big body presence in front of the net).
We all saw the past two seasons in the WCF that we were beat by teams with more speed and different kinds of talent. When I say different kinds of talent I mean this…
The Sharks need someone in their top 6 when it comes down to the nitty gritty details of the WCF and beyond who is somewhat flashy that can take the initiative and beat a guy one on one. How many times did we see Heatley enter the zone (one on one or one on two sometimes) and try to deek his way through when we all know that’s not his forte, only to see him lose the puck?! His forte was and still is his sniper, super stick-flexing shot and throwing in loose rebounds around the net with his size. Sure he could make good passes and rack up some assists but he was brought in to score goals and for us, the Sharks, that means score goals in the postseason (the season that truly means something to us). SO looking at this trade for Havlat should be seen as a perfect one because we need a guy that can flash some skill, beat a guy one on one with his speed and stick handling abilities. We kind of saw that with Seto but it was just too inconsistent for the Sharks to be happy with.
So to conclude, Heatley shouldn’t be looked at in a bad light by Sharks fans but we should just simply realize that, even though a potential elite goal scorer, he wasn’t the right kind of goal scorer we need on this particular team to get us over the hump. Doesn’t matter about injuries which may or may not have affected his “skating ability” and/or goal scoring numbers, even Heatley at his best, I don’t feel would be the right kind of player to get us over the hump like Havlat potentially could be. Havs can still dish the puck as good or even better than Heatley, definitely has better natural skating talent and definite skill with stick handling around guys similar to what datsyuk can do. Like I said, we need a player like that, that can take the initiative, dance around a guy and put into the back of the net when it really counts at the end of a deep run into the playoffs (WCF, FInals), which we would have never seen with Heatley, even if he was at his best.
SO looking at this trade for Havlat should be seen as a perfect one because we need a guy that can flash some skill, beat a guy one on one with his speed and stick handling abilities.
I think this is the upside we’re all looking for. But the injury history is disconcerting. Havlat SHOULD be that guy. Whether he WILL be that guy is a question of health. He could be that guy, but will he be when we need him, or will he be on the shelf? While him for Heater does free up cap space, that’s largely irrelevant if he’s in the press-box, and it’s not like his contract is a bargain.
We kind of saw that with Seto but it was just too inconsistent for the Sharks to be happy with.
I find this assessment unfair as Seto may have been consistent, but I don’t recall a single season where he wasn’t better than the previous. For a player of his age, that’s terrific. He’s simply part of the price we had to pay for Burns.
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but I don’t recall a single season where he wasn’t better than the previous.
Ill have to disagree with you on that one forsure. His point totals dropped ever since his breakout season in 08-09 but I’m not judging him on stats as we all know that never tells the full story. Seto was at his best when he would be flying around with his speed and using his body on the forecheck. He was inconsistent in the fact that he didn’t come out every night and show his full potential which I have to say is how I feel about Marleau too. He’s so gifted and with his size and speed, I’m disapointed he doesn’t show that more often. Its like Seto decided to show up some nights and not the others. And thats what I mean by inconsistent. He definitely lost value every season since his break out year and it was even more glaring when you have a guy like Couture coming up doing what he’s been doing.
I hate to be a nay sayer here
But Couture is in exactly the same place Seto was after his first season. Not saying Couture’s game is going to drop off or anything, but the decline in production you point out with Seto is entirely possible for Logan. It seems to me Couture, at this point in his career, is not a great example of what Seto should have been.
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I agree, they shouldnt be directly compared and I am not saying Logan is what Seto should have been because they are completely different players in their style of play. But when you have a guy like Logan who is putting up numbers like he has been, being the best Sharks player during that 6 game losing streak last year, and being a lot more consistent on a nightly basis makes Seto more expendable when considering what we had to give up in order to gain what we NEEDED in Burns.
Agreed on the trade
I think that the structure of the team is better suited for a long run in the playoffs now (provided we can stay mostly healthy towards the end of the year and into the playoffs). Our strongest D corps ever: with defensive play, offensive pop, and physicality on every line. Not to mention the depth of having Vandy and Braun available should we suffer injuries.
On the offensive side we traded three scoring lines and an afterthought 4th line for 2 legit scoring lines, a third line that can be used in shutdown situations AND provide a little scoring pop, and what looks to be a legit 4th line that can hopefully eat some tougher minutes and be on the plus side of the penalty equation (Winchester not withstanding).
I am particularly liking the acquisition of Hadzus, as I think he can play a more traditional 3rd line center role: bang bodies, be defensively sound, solid on the PK, contribute on the second PP, and provide some scoring pop against weaker defensive pairings.
Provided our forward lines can play the roles they are projected, and our PK shows the improvement that we are looking for I have great optimism for our team this year. Of course we are one game into the season, and haven’t played against any of the stronger teams yet. These will be more telling of where our team is really at.
And PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE no more games of multiple 5 on 3s. Gotta be more disciplined on the PK.
GO SHARKS!
I wasn't that happy with the trade at the time
But the cap space it opened up allowed for extensions to Burns and Couture.
My exact words when we picked up Heatley...
…were “Great, we got a scorer, but when are we going to pick up a winner?”
He performed exactly as expected. Although the scoring wasn’t nearly as prolific as wanted. Especially considering he spent almost all of that time with at last a top 3 playmaker (if not the best). Quite frankly I am going to miss Seto way more than Heatley.
I would rather be happy than right any day.
by SouthBayernMunchen on Oct 12, 2011 12:19 PM PDT reply actions
^This...
I already miss Seto…:-/
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by Sharkz_N_Phinz on Oct 12, 2011 12:44 PM PDT up reply actions
Quite frankly I am going to miss Seto way more than Heatley.
THIS.
Not that I didn’t like Heater, and I have no ill feelings towards his performance during his time here whatsoever. But he didn’t do what he was brought here to do, which was score goals, score A LOT of them. And not just a lot, but timely goals, and I didn’t see that enough from him.
One of the biggest knocks on the Sharks has been their team speed and losing Seto concerned me in that aspect, but once we picked up Havlat, my concerns were settled. We have a speedster on every line.
Havlat may not be the prolific goal scorer that Heatley is, but it’s not like the Sharks are lacking in the goal scoring department. Plus I’m convinced Pavs is gonna have another career year on that top line. Havlat’s injury history is a legit concern, but when he’s 100% healthy playing along side Logan and Clowe, I don’t think I’ll be missing Heatley much at all.
I find myself rooting
for the Wild a lot more this season than in seasons past, and Heater + Seto are a big part of that.
I’m not about to run out and buy Wild memorabilia to display alongside my Sharks stuff, but I do enjoy seeing them do well.
by Old Kentucky Shark on Oct 12, 2011 1:08 PM PDT reply actions
I've watched 3 Minnesota WIld games this year already
That’s 3 more Wild games than I watched all last season (not including the games vs the Sharks)
Yeah, with the free Center Ice package this month
And the lack of Sharks on my TV this week, I have been watching the Wild games.
by WhatsAMataHari on Oct 12, 2011 1:55 PM PDT up reply actions
Going to miss Seto the most out of the two.
Postseason is when memorable Sharks are made for me, and because of his injuries, Heatley never reached that for me.
Hopefully they both do fine for a 6th seed Wild team that upsets Detroit in the 1st round before bowing out.
If all sports fandom is a form of emotional gambling, football is poker and hockey is Russian roulette.
I feel bad for Seto
He had just signed an extension with the team thinking he was going to stay for awhile and then he got traded immediately after.
I do like the trades and I feel we are a better team with the freed money and with burns and havlat. Yes havlat is never going to score 50 goals in a season but he is faster and also has a play making ability that heatley had, but didn’t seem to use very much. I just think that heater didn’t fit as well
by slotownsharksfan on Oct 12, 2011 1:58 PM PDT reply actions
I feel bad for Seto too
especially right after he signs the extension, he’s shipped off. But in the end it’s a business and Seto wasn’t traded because he was a bad guy or anything off the ice. Remember Seto was part of the Burns deal so you really have to ask yourself A) do you think adding Burns gets us a step close r to the cup? and B) who should we have given up to get Burns…Seto?Couture?..
So looking at everything, including the Heatley, Havlat trade offs, DW has given this team a better chance than ever to win the CUP!
The way I see it
DW’s bromance with Chuck Fletcher this off-season pretty much makes me see all of the trades as ONE big transaction rather than 3 separate deals. But for the sake of this post, I’ll only consider the two big ones (sorry James Sheppard).
It seems DW got his trades assets a little mixed up— Would I trade Heatley for Burns? Yes. Would I trade Seto for Havlat? Yes. And I know Coyle and picks were included as well, but I feel personally, with a team that’s built to win now (like the Sharks), the only pieces that matter at the moment are the ones that will help us win now.
In all reality, I think both teams get better and these trades end up being a win-win on all sides.
Heatley for Burns straight up wouldn't have happened
I honestly don’t think a straight trade for Burns by shipping Heatley is what Fletcher was willing to do. He obviously felt Burns was worth more value to the Wild than DW thought Heatley was worth to the Sharks. In all, giving up someone like Seto (instead of someone like Couture) with a very very promising prospect in Coyle along with some picks is a very very fair trade, considering the needs of both teams at the time.
But I do like looking at everything as ONE big transaction like you say because then you theoretically say that, yes, we gave the wild heatley for Burns and we gave Seto for Havlat because it makes you feel better but then, wait, we also lost Coyle and picks. Either way, these moves has made the Sharks a better team to win NOW and made the Wild a better team overall, but still not a contender like the Sharks.
Heatley’s loophole in his NTC with the 10 teams to be traded to didn’t begin until July 1st- possibly one reason why there wasn’t a Heatley for Burns trade.
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true
But I bet if DW tried to do a straight trade between Heater and Burns, Fletcher would have said no. Just saying.
Fletcher made it clear that the main part of the Seto for Burns trade was Coyle, Seto was the kicker. So I agree with you that Heater for Burns straight up probably wouldn’t have happened. Fletcher wanted Coyle.
It’s not that it makes me feel better (per se), it just gives me a clearer perspective on the overall picture of what DW is trying to do with this team. Trust me, the day the Heatley for Havlat trade happened, I was not a fan of it at first, but when I realized the extra cap space enabled us to re-sign Burns/Couture, I took a step back and finally warmed up to it. Losing Coyle and those picks may sting in the future, but if these moves made this off-season help us win the cup this year (or soon), then screw the prospects…WE GOT THE CUP!
And also watching Havlat’s top 10 goals on YouTube a million times also made me a big fan of the move as well…they’re some of the sweetest goals ever.
Ya, from the interview that plank had with wilson during the offseason, dw hinted that the trades were in fact related but it was a timing issue. So the Heatley for Havlat straight up trade that everyone will use as a reason to compare the two players was never really valid.
But looking at who we got compared to who we shipped off, especially when you look at who we gave up for heatley in the first place, we absolutely win unless coyle turns out to be a mega superstar, which I kind of doubt will happen
by slotownsharksfan on Oct 12, 2011 4:50 PM PDT up reply actions
Yes and no.
Sucks to get dealt like that, but Wilson did good on him otherwise. He didn’t sign a lifetime contract like Mike Richards, give up millions and get dealt before the NTC set in. He got a good deal for his results so far, and it just so happens to expire right when he can go UFA and choose his own future if it turns out he doesn’t like Minnesota.
If all sports fandom is a form of emotional gambling, football is poker and hockey is Russian roulette.
I only hope Heatley does poorly as a direct comparison to Havlat simply to make me feel better about the trade.
I didn’t like Heatley’s slow speed and lack of conditioning last year, but he still put up a solid amount of points and played the end of the season and the playoffs with numerous hampering injuries (you break your hand and until thats fully healed any pressure is painful). As a result, I disliked the straight up Heatley for Havlat trade, regardless of the cap space freeups that allowed for other resignings (since Nitty was coming off the books next year + the extra cap space, it could have been done anyways just with less wiggle room).
Thus since I didn’t like the straight up trade, I can only hope for poor results from Heatley just to make myself feel better about losing him, nothing personal directly towards him.
Honestly
Winning a cup will make me feel much better than Havlat outperforming Heater in any stats.
GO SHARKS!
Winning a cup will make me feel much better than Havlat outperforming Heater in any stats.
Exactly. The moves that DW made with Heatley and Seto, I believe, has put us in a better position to get there than ever before.
I hope he does well in every game except the games against us.
Same goes for Seto. Gotta love the guys, but it’ll be too emotional if they start racking up points on us.
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Proud fan of the Atlanta Thrashers (1999-2011)
I am extremely conflicted
On one hand, I am a catty and vindictive individual with a mean competitive streak, so I want Heatley to do poorly in Minnesota so I can say, “Ha! Doug Wilson pulled off another awesome trade!” The fact that Havlat hasn’t played yet and Heatley is a revelation for the Wild isn’t helping.
On the other, I do feel bad for Heatley – he wanted to play for the Sharks, and it wasn’t entirely his fault that he kept getting injured right before the playoffs. Maybe he would have come out and played for the Sharks like he’s playing for the Wild, maybe not. I do wish him well, and by no means want him to become another Cheechoo.
I still really haven’t processed the trades. I mean, I know the Sharks have Burns and Havlat and all, but it’s still weird that Setoguchi and Heatley aren’t members of the San Jose Sharks organization.
Fear the Fin - NEEDS MORE DOVES
even if Heatley doesn't do well
Lets say Heater does well and scores 50 goals again and has a terrific year for MINN, I’d still be saying, “DW pulled off another awesome trade!” because even a top-notch Heatley isn’t going to make a mediocre Wild team better than this Sharks team. If these two teams met any time in the playoffs, the Sharks would come out on top because DW has made this team better than last years team. I don’t care if Heatley turns into Crosby (HIGHLY UNLIKELY), his team will still get beat by us. SOO that’s why I can say, “Heatley, I hope you return to top form and wish you the best of luck” because I will still not be threatened by him or them and neither should other Sharks fans.
I didn't know there was a contingent of Sharks fans against him.
News to me. We brought him in to score goals, more specifically in the playoffs because he had done well in the postseason. He was unimpressive and always injured in the playoffs with us, so rather than hope the third time’s the charm, DW wanted to move on and go in a different direction.
Seems pretty simple and justified. But I don’t care how Heatley does in Minnesota. I hope Seto does well, though.
I'd like to see them both do well
Doug Wilson has at times seemed to have the magic hand, trading away players right before they are no longer able to play (Rathje, McLaren — though that was nullified) or only get a sniff at the NHL again (Cheechoo, Lukowich).
Sometimes I question whether he knows something that he isn’t letting on. If Heatley was to remain hampered by injury and never return to what he was expected to be, other teams in the league might associate San Jose with “caveat emptor”, which could make future deals harder.
In this sense it would be somewhat beneficial for Heater and Seto to do well
I do like what DW said (something along the lines of: “this trade helps both teams”), and if Seto and Heatley provide the scoring that the Wild are looking for (off to a good start) DW further enhances his reputation as a willing and effective trade partner.
GO SHARKS!
no magic
Its not that DW is a magician and can tell when a player is just going to drop off drastically like Cheechoo. It’s just he looks how that person performed the previous season, sometimes the previous two season in Heatley’s case, and asks himself, “is this person going to make us a better team next year and help us get to that ultimate goal of winning the Cup?” When that question was asked to himself about Heatley, the answer was obviously no because his skillset is just not what the Sharks need in the type of style of hockey they are setup to play right now to win the Cup right now.
But remember when he traded for Heatley? Our blueline was pretty good, but he honestly felt that we were missing that one, electrifying goal scorer that could get us to the Cup and took that risk on Heatley. Unfortunately that risk panned out for whatever reason something that didn’t take us as far as we would have liked, so you keep building from what you have.
Before Heatley, we were a worse team with Cheechoo and Michalek. Got significantly better with him but not good enough. Now we need to take one step above and beyond that and DW feels Burns and Havlat are the pieces that will take us one step further in the RIGHT direction. So it’s about building and moving forward in the right direction from what you have.
Elephant in the room
Great article! I’ve been following DH and Seto at the Wild because I just became a Sharks fan last year and they were part of that team, so I’ll always have a good thought. Manystill have mixed feelings about the trades and that and the Heatly rep needed to be aired out. Personally, I’ll miss them, now matter how many goals they didn’t score or how much money they made. They were Sharks. I hope we have more class than Ottowa and don’t bully and boo him when he comes to town.
DH leaving OTT is very different than DH leaving SJ
I don’t think SJ fans will have the same kind of resentment or anywhere to the same extent towards DH considering how he left SJ compared to OTT. We all know DH left OTT on bad terms because of the details that were publicly leaked. But his departure with SJ was MUCH different…he didn’t choose to leave SJ and then when he was traded he didn’t refuse to go to that team (well it was in his contract that MIN was a team he’d be willing to go to). So when he comes back to town I would like to think we SJ fans are smart enough to realize that we shouldn’t have really any “hate” towards him and come to the conclusion that shipping him off for the pieces we got benefits both sides. Just enjoy what this Sharks team is going to do and wish DH the best of luck where he’s going because MIN is going to need all the luck they can get if they want to make a deep run in the playoffs.
PS. wouldn’t that be a nice WCF series, MIN vs SJ?! Here’s to hoping!
“Elephant in the room”
But Kyle Wellwood is not a member of the San Jose Sharks organization!
"Logan Couture is a dirty, filthy man. Tell all your friends" - Mr. Plank
Welcome to the NHL, Atlanta Thrashers of Winnipeg.
by Bockerz on Oct 13, 2011 7:39 PM PDT up reply actions 3 recs
pff...feelings.
No need to “feel” unless your hot date is nearby and heavy petting leads to " the hunka-chunka! " as Sly Stallone once said, otherwise I think we all know that SJ is better than Minnesota.
@suisundan
I also think it would be a fallacy
to believe that Heatley, if he puts up 40+ goals in Minn, would have had as good a year if he were still in SJ. Even though I know people will do that. If he has a good year, people will say “look how good he’s doing, DW was stupid for trading him” without regard to the possibility that the reason for his good season might be the trade to Minn itself.
Heatly Record
Just read a Bleacher Report article that said DH has the second best production(behind Joe Thorton) in franchise history at .901 points per game.
I hope he succeeds
/SNIFF. Yeah definitely.
Same goes for Seto.
BEAT DAT BEAT
by DownRUpLYB on Oct 13, 2011 7:17 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
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